The Elan Vital organisation - considered by many observers to be a cult, is using the stigmatisation of psychological distress and mental ill health to denigrate its critics
Elan Vital, which operates out of the Ivory's Rock Conference Centre, near Ipswich, Queensland, stands accused of using the deliberate stigmatisation of psychological distress and mental ill health as a device to discredit its critics.
The organisation, which has gained recent notoriety through its bitter legal attempt to silence Australian journalist John Macgregor, has published a series of FAQs on its website in which various unnamed members of a claimed 'hate group' are identified by their supposed mental incapacity.
http://www.elanvital.com.au/faq/idx/11/084/article/ :
QUOTE
Are the people in this hate group credible?
Of the 15-20 people posting as various anonymous personae on the hate site, it has been documented that:
One has been hospitalised for hallucinatory paranoia.
One has acknowledged suffering from multiple personality disorder.
One became a member of the hate group after surgery to remove a brain tumour that affected his cognitive abilities.
One receives a pension for permanent mental disability
END QUOTE
Whether Elan Vital has any reason to make its hate group claim is open to question. It is however wholly unacceptable for any organisation no matter how oppressed it may feel, to use public fear and ignorance of mental health issues as a basis to attack its critics.
Elan Vital's tactics in its attempts to silence John Macgregor were stikingly similar to those pioneered by the Church of Scientology and which have been promoted by the highly dubious CESNUR organisation. Scientology has a well established antipathy toward the treatment of mental health problems and it seems that this may be another area of commonality between the belief systems of Elan Vital and the CoS.
Given Elan Vital's attitude to those who suffer mental ill health and its reliance upon litigation there is some irony in that Quinn & Scattini, Elan Vital's Australian lawyers, have as international partners, a firm of UK solicitors which is currently acting for suffers of clinical depression in a class action against the makers of Seroxat.
Not that Quinn & Scattini have any difficulty playing which ever side of a moral question their client pays for. Elan Vital has been involved in a well publicised sexual abuse scandal in which the victims were pressured to accept a paltry settlement - Quinn & Scattini trumpets itself as a defender of abuse victims rights but the Elan Vital dollar clearly persuades the firm to adopt a 'see no evil' approach when it comes to the abuse perpetrated by a senior Elan Vital operative.
http://www.elanvital.com.au/elan_01.html
http://www.quinnscattini.com.au/
The organisation, which has gained recent notoriety through its bitter legal attempt to silence Australian journalist John Macgregor, has published a series of FAQs on its website in which various unnamed members of a claimed 'hate group' are identified by their supposed mental incapacity.
http://www.elanvital.com.au/faq/idx/11/084/article/ : QUOTE
Are the people in this hate group credible?
Of the 15-20 people posting as various anonymous personae on the hate site, it has been documented that:
One has been hospitalised for hallucinatory paranoia.
One has acknowledged suffering from multiple personality disorder.
One became a member of the hate group after surgery to remove a brain tumour that affected his cognitive abilities.
One receives a pension for permanent mental disability
END QUOTE
Whether Elan Vital has any reason to make its hate group claim is open to question. It is however wholly unacceptable for any organisation no matter how oppressed it may feel, to use public fear and ignorance of mental health issues as a basis to attack its critics.
Elan Vital's tactics in its attempts to silence John Macgregor were stikingly similar to those pioneered by the Church of Scientology and which have been promoted by the highly dubious CESNUR organisation. Scientology has a well established antipathy toward the treatment of mental health problems and it seems that this may be another area of commonality between the belief systems of Elan Vital and the CoS.
Given Elan Vital's attitude to those who suffer mental ill health and its reliance upon litigation there is some irony in that Quinn & Scattini, Elan Vital's Australian lawyers, have as international partners, a firm of UK solicitors which is currently acting for suffers of clinical depression in a class action against the makers of Seroxat.
Not that Quinn & Scattini have any difficulty playing which ever side of a moral question their client pays for. Elan Vital has been involved in a well publicised sexual abuse scandal in which the victims were pressured to accept a paltry settlement - Quinn & Scattini trumpets itself as a defender of abuse victims rights but the Elan Vital dollar clearly persuades the firm to adopt a 'see no evil' approach when it comes to the abuse perpetrated by a senior Elan Vital operative.
http://www.elanvital.com.au/elan_01.html http://www.quinnscattini.com.au/
Comments
Hide the following 16 comments
This rebuttal is laughable
12.05.2004 20:03
Chris
Baffle them with ......?
12.05.2004 20:44
Legally castigated and ultimately journalistically rejected they now cower behind articles like this(ghosted by whom??)seeking some form of legitimacy by osmosis!
The facts? Major critic number One , a Mr Neville Ackland is doing hard time for totally unrelated drug offences. Critic No Two Mr John Macgregor has been found to be in breach of the law by the Supreme Court and is currently on the run avoiding service of documents for further and continued litigation.
It IS a HATE group. It's only purpose is antagonism antipathy and aggravation. It organised a disgraceful illegal Email fraud against Lawyer Denis Scattini whereby legal firms, Courts and Media outlets received a bogus email in Scattini's name. Ordinary people simply attempting to improve their quality of life through personal development have had their Employers contacted and harrassed,their friends and neighbours unduly alarmed and their computers sent endless Virus and Cyber threats.
It is documented beyond dispute that key members of this Hate group DO in fact suffer from diagnosed and in some cases UNTREATED mental illness's. To say that their behavior is obsessive,uncontrolled and threatening is a master of understatement.They have made threats against the life of both key speakers for Elan Vital and their children. This has caused great discomfort.
Dont be mislead. This trite piece of drivel hides a truly evil and hypocritical agenda of malice. Do not support it
Peter G
It is not a hate group
12.05.2004 20:56
People getting involved should know about who and what they are getting involved in.
In the 80s Rowatt, then known as Maharaji or Guru Maharaj Ji, ordered all publications and videos from that era destroyed.
Some people still value truth.
All kudos to John Macgregor.
Alex
Alex Simmonds
Again...who ever writes about it is an ignorant, not a journalist
12.05.2004 21:47
Is anyone aware of the ignorance of those who post against EV ? To think that some of them call themselves "journalists" makes me giggle. What a fraud!
It is always the same old story, same pattern, different arguments.
What's more, don't forget who plays the role of victim here...as always...
Heller, Brauns, Mc Gregor, Bachers, Neville, etc... these people are the ones with big mouths filled with disgusting attacks. I am surprised some of them are still free to publish difamatory statements. Some of them even call themselves lawyers. Ha ha ha! It's like a driver licence, anyone can buy one over the counter.
A small hate group represented by a few leaders which have being already crossing the legal line, guilty of lying or proven criminals. But let them go on... thanks to their continuous mistakes more of them will end up in jail and join their buddy.
Robert
e-mail:
bschein@hotmail.com
It is worse than this article says.
12.05.2004 22:47
an exceptionally poor record of mental abuse and then harshly condemning its own followers that are driven crazy by the leader and his madness.
Like the american mafia, where the leaders primarily kill thier own members for small or imagined death deserving deeds, prem rawat uses, abuses, then discards and condemns his
followers, turned devotees, turned lifelong servants.
Those that look back at thier time involved with prem rawats narcissistic world and
see the manipulation and fraud and abuse, and have the sense to criticise and provide methods to alert possible new victims so they can avoid the total waste of time with prem rawat, those that are good enough and have the sense to know this abuse should not go unapposed, are of course called "crazy" by those still in the cult.
By SOME of those in the cult. MANY have been greatly helped by the work of many ex members who have provided information and a forum where cult members can get the help they need to untangle the lies rawat spins and step free of his completely useless influence. Worse than completely useless, he is a ruiner of vast numbers of lives.
Get a load of his own family! he refused to see his own mom for 17 years till she finally died. He has refuse to see 2 of his 3 brothers since 1975! His kids never saw thier grandmother, uncles or cousins! Looks like he really deserves his self named title of..........MASTER OF LIFE.....it is way worse than even this.
For more, check out expremie on the web.
bill burke
e-mail:
bburke@rocketmail.com
Homepage:
http://non
As Mr. Schein has mentioned my name
12.05.2004 22:49
--------------------------------------------------
You have posted on the UK Indymedia site that I 'have a big mouth filled with disgusting attacks'. Could you give me an example of one of my disgusting attacks?
As I'm sure you know, I run www.ex-premie.org which publishes information about Prem Rawat that is not available on his official websites. In the almost three years I have run the site I have asked Rawat and Elan Vital to correct any inaccuracies. They have made no effort to do so. They also made no attempt to contact the previous webmasters who ran the site for the previous four years.
Examples of information on the website are that Rawat's followers line up to kiss his feet, that Rawat is a heavy drinker, that his followers sing a song to him that describes him as 'the Superior Power in Person', that he has a mistress whose presence is kept hidden from his wife, that he lied about his Indian heritage, that he used his followers for sex and discarded them afterwards, that he spent the 70s and early 80 explicitly encouraging his followers to believe he is God, and that he has smoked cannabis.
Instead of attacking Rawat's critics, why don't you try addressing some of the allegations against Rawat?
John Brauns
webmaster www.ex-premie.org
email:
John Brauns
e-mail:
epowebmaster@yahoo.co.uk
Homepage:
http://www.ex-premie.org
So lost, so lonely, so confused.
13.05.2004 07:37
It doesn't hide the fact that you are seriously shaken by being comprehensively ignored by your so called 'enemies' who have demonstrated that they want nothing to do with any of you. At the same time you have been comprehensively exposed in the mainstream media for being a petty, distorted little hate club.
Your time has come to GET A LIFE.
Chistopher Wallis
Mr Schein and Mr Wallis
13.05.2004 09:22
One thing Rawat's critics would welcome is an honest discussion of the allegations on www.ex-premie.org, preferably with Mr. Rawat himself, but failing that, senior figures in Elan Vital or the prem Rawat Foundation, or even Mr. Schein or Mr. Wallis themselves!
We live in hope.
John Brauns
e-mail:
epowebmaster@yahoo.co.uk
Homepage:
http://www.ex-premie.org
Hey Mr Brauns
13.05.2004 09:46
isn't it time you tell the truth...pfff..living in hope...no, non, no!
You ought to write "living in hate".
And by the way my email works just fine you idiot! Begin by knowing how to use a computer before you write your usual lies mister.
Robert Schein
e-mail:
bschein@hotmail.com
Hell yeah I hate him!
13.05.2004 10:43
Seems a frightening thing to cult members that is for sure. The only way
to stay in the cult is to revere the self proclaimed lord of the universe.
Is there a way to join a web site where the sole purpose is to find a way to
kill rawat? What would I be labeled then?
Apparently there are plenty of folks that want to take him out if we are to guess at why
rawat has metal detectors and body and bag searches at his public talks.
How many lord of the universes are there touring that have such need for security
from thier followers as he speaks about truth?
Typical aint it? The cult recoils in horror at people having a genuine human feeling.
The only allowed thought and feeling allowed is to -revere-appreciate-serve.
For the rest of your life.
No graduation ceremonies in the cult is there.
bill burke
e-mail:
bburke@rocketmail.com
A cult by any other name
13.05.2004 16:47
The internet is not a forum where people can use carte blanche to flout the law.
This group is clearly a cult. I should think that they doth protest to much about the mental health of people who criticise them.
Joan Sanderson
Oxford
Joan Sanderson
Allegations?
14.05.2004 03:48
Bill Burke (aptly named) states that 'the cult recoils in horror at people having a genuine human feeling'.
Is that so Burke? Well, if you represent what it is like to have genuine human feeling, count me right out of the loop.
Then the laughable Joan Sanderson says "The internet is not a forum where people can use carte blanche to flout the law.'
I don't think I have ever read anything displaying so much ignorance and stupidity - on the internet.
No, of course it isn't Joan, the hate club has never done that have they? And cars don't have wheels, planes don't have wings, the sea isn't blue, milk isn't white and dogs don't bark - do they Joan.
Thicker than bricks. But much more insidious.
Christopher Wallis
Thicker than a brick
14.05.2004 06:59
That is without doubt the stupidest, most ignorant thing I have ever read on the internet.
As for Bill Burke, you should be locked up.
Christopher Wallis
The Killing of a Cyclist
14.05.2004 13:38
he is the one that should be focused. The cult tries to hide his private life, for
if the public would know of what is going on there, his character would get revealed over the media and the business would die right away. So let us start with one incidence.
Maharaji aka "Prem Rawat" aka "The Lord of the Universe" aka "Creator Preserver Destroyer", killed a cyclist in India with his car and let one of his followers take responsibilty for it. Just one story. There are many others. Please feel free to investigate.
Material can be found on
He feares the press like hell, and i think it should be the duty of any serious journalist, to bring some light into this darkness.
Toby
Berlin,Germany
Toby
Who is Prem Rawat? What is Knowledge?
14.05.2004 17:34
And what of his critics, a Hate Group with less than 20 active members? Neville Ackland is in jail, and his mentor, John Macgregor, will probably soon join him. A group member or supporter has posted a death threat on this web site! Brauns likes to claim that we are not capable of a rational response to their hearsay and libelous, deceptive drivel. Whenever we do so, they scream "cult apologist" or "scientology tactics." Are they psychologically disturbed? If someone spends hundreds of hours on the internet, obsessing over something they claim to have left 10, 20, or 30 years ago, is that person likely to be fully rational?
Webmaster, www.one-reality.net
webmaster, www.one-reality.net
Homepage:
http://www.one-reality.net
Who is Using Who Here ?
15.05.2004 09:51
For anyone who is actually interested in fighting prejudice and the cosy money spinner that goes on between lawyers and the drug firms:
Seroxat is made by Glaxo Smith Kline. The lawyers touting for business from those who've got addicted to GSK's drugs are Hugh James Solicitors. GSK will continue making £millions out of Seroxat and they know that even if they have to pay up some compensation it will be to only a fraction of those who've got addicted. The lawyers will try to get a wedge off the legal aid board and the whole legal process will take years, by which time GSK will have a whole new product to sell and the lawyers will have earned kudos and mega fees from the Courts. Meanwhile more and more people are suffering clinical depression and the likes of Elan Vital only add to the prejudice they face.
Karly