So the drug squad protect my kids, hey? I don't know where this post came from but it is as niave as the socialist whatever is stupid. Surely the point is that niether the police nor any external force will protect us from the problems within our own societies, as the police often say themselves when they bleat for co-operation from the community

who r u jack

what is ur game

if u are genuine, then it is quite obvious that u have had no experience of the police first hand (except for being one urself). The police use these non-lethal wepons not to save crying childeren from the clutches of evil doers, but to bully anyone who dares to question their authority (unfortunatley this is probably a sad cycle of violence i.e. bullied becomes bully).

i shall no longer honour this any further

Who'd vote for above with candidates like Louise Christian , so called Human rights barrister,who, ho ho, failed to extract UK terrorist suspects from US detention in Guantanamo, Cuba

the only way to protect the interests of our community is to get the community interested in looking after it's own affairs. trendy lefty barristers and radical chic types only look after their own shit, and sell out to corporates much the same as the right wing. left and right have no bearing on the security of our communities. we have to do it ourselves.
It's quite possible. Bristol seems to be having a go at it. wish them all the best . Owen the .....

Check out the Socialist Alliance website for yourselves, then make your own mind up :  http://www.socialistalliance.net/

They are good alternative electorally to the shite "main" parties and of course the fuckwit nazis of the BNP who are trying to get votes by appearing respectable. If the Socialist Alliance or Scottish Socialist Party is standing in your area then instead of wasting your vote (I had to do this in the general election),put your X in their box. Electoral politics isn't the b all and end all of activity against this system, but for many people it is a start.

For those of you who didn't know, "Jack" is a BNP Nazi and this is a troll post.

Ask yourselves a question: How many persons have been killed by anti-capitalist protestors in the past couple of years . . . Erm, the answer is - no-one.

And how many people have been killed by Jack's mates in Combat 18? Well, quite a few actually. Not to mention the race riots they started, the firebombings, the hate mail, the letter bombs, the random beatings of innocent passers-by, the attack on anti-racist football supporters' associations ad nauseum ad infinitum.

Jack will deny that he represents the BNP, because he is too ashamed to admit his real agenda. Behind his attacks on the Anti Nazi League, the Socialist Alliance and "immigrants" lies a toxic vat of hatred directed at ethnic minorities, gays and lesbians, and those interested in promoting openness and tolerance. It is a sick irony that these fascist parasites hide behind the rhetoric of "nationalism", since everything they stand for is an affront to decent English people.

I'm not a supporter of Combat 18, they're a non-democratic organisation whereas I support democracy. Combat 18 are nothing to do with the BNP these days. Both politically correct government reports into the race riots stated the BNP was not responsible for inciting them, they cited tension between the communities (including 60% of racial attacks being against white people, not bad going seeing as Muslims are 10% of the population) and a perception (which is probably true) that more money was being spent on the Muslim community.

My "attack" on the Socialist Alliance consisted of writing-up their own manifesto entry. You could say that was enough of an attack really, seeing as their policies would result in a massive increase in crime. The police are there for a reason, before them we had a massive crime problem, communities can't protect themselves as well because there has to be a system that deals with people in a professional way through the courts. The Socialist Alliance, being a Trotskyite organisation, would of course use all the measures they disagree with to clamp down on any anti Communists if they ever got into power. Organisations like the Socialist Alliance are completely against democracy and free speech, so to think they represent a "refreshing alternative" is sheer lunacy.

Yes, Jack, we saw your democracy in operation in the 1930s and 1940s, when Germans democratically elected the Nazis who systematically murdered Jews, Gypsies, gays, communists and even Catholics in their millions. Of course, the Nazi BNP denies this ever happened, with Tyndall, Griffin and Irving suggesting the holocaust was just a malicious rumour spread by the international Jewry. This just gives a rational varnish to their violent race hate - the subtext of Jack's drivel.
If you want a terrorist government which tortures, rapes and murders, vote for Hitler's prodigies, the BNP - a gang of thugs whose leaders have a long list of convictions for violent racist assaults. Yep, the best way to stop violent crime is to elect violent criminals, like John Tyndall.
Hey, Jack, I'm no avid supporter of the Socialist Alliance, but at least I know they'd be on my side of the barricade and you skinheads will be with the police and their goons.

What about the communists who killed 7 million Ukrainian farmers by starvation and murder? The Socialist Alliance admires the likes of Stalin, Lenin, the people who let out the tanks onto demonstrators in China.. More people have died under the communists than under the Nazis. What's more, the BNP don't even admire the Nazis, because we aren't a national socialist party, we're nationalists.

Anyone who openly acknowledges themselves as being a member of a fascist organsiation like the BNP should not be allowed have their vile racist opinions posted on indymedia. These people want to destroy the democratic
rights of workers, young people and all those fighting back against the system. Why should we give freedom
of expression to those who want to take that most fundamental right that has been won ordinary people under
capitalism. These people are complete scum. They seek to deny the existance of the gas chambers and that
holocaust ever took place. They also want to return to the nazi type persecution of ethnic minorities,gays and
the disabled. We should oppose these people everywhere they seek to organise.
NO PASARAN! SMASH THE NATIONAL FRONT,BNP,COMBAT 18!
FOR A SOCIALIST SOCIETY FREE FROM RACISM AND ROOT CAUSES OF FASCIASM!

I haven't come across this Jack before, but from his posting I have not found anything that connects him with Facism, Nazism, the BNP or any other of these despicable thugs. His points about the millions massacared at the hands of so-called "Socailists", "Marxists", and "Left-wingers", such as Mao and Stalin are completely valid.

I understand how stopping the use of CS gas, handcuffs, etc, will severely cripply the ability of the police to protect innocent people (which is what it is meant for!).

However, if you read the Socialist Alliance manifesto, at Jack's quote can be found at  http://www.socialistalliance.net/manifesto/democratic.htm , it says that it will end the use of CS gas, batons, manacles and other forms of weaponry on VULNERABLE PEOPLE. It doesn't say anything about criminals. I also am aware that in the past (and this sadly will probably continue), the treatment of the public at the hands of the police (esp. with those who are critical of the current government and/or system, such as anti-capitalists), has been very poor at best, and at worst utterly disgraceful. From what I have read, the "special police units" that the Socialist Alliance want to disband mean groups like the Flying Squad and the like, not groups like the dog units who look for missing people and therefore provide a benifit to the communtiy.

Personally, I would have no qualms about voting Socialist Alliance, purely because I feel that New Labour has betrayed me and everyone else who believed in the Labour party.

If you really want to know the facts Jack, I suggest that you e-mail the Socialist Alliance at  office@socialistalliance.net and find out EXACTLY what they will do if they got into power.

Have I said anything racist? No.
Am I racist? No.
Did I say I disagreed with democracy? No.
Did I say I wanted to take it away? No.
Did I "deny" the Holocaust? No.
Did I say I wanted gays, ethnic minorities and the disabled to be persecuted? No.

Does the BNP want these things? No.

I think you have your wires crossed in your hysterical outburst. The BNP just wants to stand-up for British people and defend their rights.

This is a typical tactic of the Nazi's they put
up some provocative statement, then get a 'moderate' to
back them up! Don't be deceived both "Jack" and "Moderate" are Nazi's

"The BNP just wants to stand-up for British people and defend their rights"

Do you include non-white british people in this category or do you think this is an oxymoron?

Personally, I do have some sympathy for some of the people who vote BNP in say, Oldham. Most of the time people aren't very 'ideological' and tend to respond to people who show an interest. The BNP have put in a lot of effort going to these areas, talking to white people and giving them one particular understanding of what is going on and why their lives are so hard ie. 'you have no money, there are no jobs, council services are shit and no-one stands up for your interests - this is the fault of the asians who are treated with kid gloves and get preferential treatment from the authorities'.

Whether you like it or not, there is some truth in this story. Labour no longer even pretends to care about these people. Money for regeneration gets spent in the poorest of the poor areas and these are often where asians live. This means that poor whites see asian areas being developed while their estates are left to rot. Official backing for something called 'Multi-culturalism' has allowed asian 'community leaders' a role in representing 'their people' ie delivering the vote to corrupt party machines in return for some community benefits and enhanced status for themselves. This can easily be interpreted as Lording it and is unfair.

I think that the problem comes when people see people vote BNP and come out with something like 'everyone who votes BNP is a thick racist'. Sure, we can all agree that BNP party members may be beyond hope and from time to time require a good kicking, but that isn't going to stop them on its own. (SWP/ANL don't even do this sort of thing - they prefer to hold a rally with the local asian community so the BNP gets loads of free publicity and the white communities is alienated even further)

What we need to do is engage white communities directly with a decent narrative which opposes the racist analysis of the BNP and encourages people to stand up for themselves against the people who hold power or choose to fuck up their communities, rather than fighting the asians who are just more visible. I reckon that this should include ideas about how to deal with shits who mug people, like they have done in Bristol.

Oh yeah, I like the 'Have I said anything racist?' line. The political class, of which Jack appears to aspire to belong, hardly ever says anything overtly racist but their immigration policies are based on an acceptance that racial tension is an inevitable, (ie understandable) reaction to all those strange looking people coming into your neighbourhood - so that's racist isn't it?

Antonius Cliffus, how dare you accuse me of being a Nazi! I never even know this "Jack" b4 I went on-line, and I was simply trying to see both sides of the argument. Well this so-called "Nazi" is actually a pacifist, and above all someone how supports (and respects) human rights. ( I loathe the BNP, NF, and all those other thugs who claim to be acting in Britain's best intresets. I can now see that Jack is a hypocrite if he says that he doesn't want gays, blacks, etc. to be percuted, but to say that the BNP doesn't want that is complete bulls***. I refuse to carry on dispensing the virtiol because I don't wanna give you the satisfaction. The reason that I am replying is that people will read your bollocks and develop a misconception about who I am, and what I believe in, which is not Nazism, Facism, or any other "ism", that promotes violence and suffering amongst my fellow men and women.

"The BNP just wants to stand-up for British people and defend their rights"

Do you include non-white british people in this category or do you think this is an oxymoron?

Personally, I do have some sympathy for some of the people who vote BNP in say, Oldham. Most of the time people aren't very 'ideological' and tend to respond to people who show an interest. The BNP have put in a lot of effort going to these areas, talking to white people and giving them one particular understanding of what is going on and why their lives are so hard ie. 'you have no money, there are no jobs, council services are shit and no-one stands up for your interests - this is the fault of the asians who are treated with kid gloves and get preferential treatment from the authorities'.

Whether you like it or not, there is some truth in this story. Labour no longer even pretends to care about these people. Money for regeneration gets spent in the poorest of the poor areas and these are often where asians live. This means that poor whites see asian areas being developed while their estates are left to rot. Official backing for something called 'Multi-culturalism' has allowed asian 'community leaders' a role in representing 'their people' ie delivering the vote to corrupt party machines in return for some community benefits and enhanced status for themselves. This can easily be interpreted as Lording it and is unfair.

I think that the problem comes when people see people vote BNP and come out with something like 'everyone who votes BNP is a thick racist'. Sure, we can all agree that BNP party members may be beyond hope and from time to time require a good kicking, but that isn't going to stop them on its own. (SWP/ANL don't even do this sort of thing - they prefer to hold a rally with the local asian community so the BNP gets loads of free publicity and the white communities is alienated even further)

What we need to do is engage white communities directly with a decent narrative which opposes the racist analysis of the BNP and encourages people to stand up for themselves against the people who hold power or choose to fuck up their communities, rather than fighting the asians who are just more visible. I reckon that this should include ideas about how to deal with shits who mug people, like they have done in Bristol.

Oh yeah, I like the 'Have I said anything racist?' line. The political class, of which you aspire to belong, hardly ever says anything overtly racist but their immigration policies are based on an acceptance that racial tension is an inevitable, (ie understandable) reaction to all those strange looking people coming into your neighbourhood - so that's racist isn't it?

By the way Jack, the Socialist Alliance would do 1 million times the job that the BNP would do in "standing up for British people and defending their rights", and a lot more than New Labour or the Tories would do! And when I say "British" I mean everyone who is living in Britain, including blacks, whites, Asians, homosexuals, heterosexuals, men, women, in a word - ANYONE.

Why's Jack so keen for the police to keep handcuffs anyway? Is there something in your private life you'd like to share?

We would not have the Smack problem here today if it werent directly due to pigs, targeting soft drug dealers, whilst turining a blind eye to and ignoring big time smack pushers.In Brixton in the 1980's there were 2 well known smack pushers, supplying the likes of the socialite jet set and lowly punks, who jokingly claimed they got their smack supply from the brixton pig station, only they werent joking.The pigs By allowing and promoting heroin use, were creating more crime, as desperate smack junkies went on crime sprees to finance their £100 a day smack habits, burgalaries and muggings sored. Just why did Pigs introduce smack to working class communities, mainly to passify youngsters into a comatose stupers, so youngsters would be too busy trying to score their next fix, to bother about protesting or rebelling against the system, the rich and the political establishment. This is why for 30 years now, republicans in Belfast have sucessfully prevented Smack introduction into working class areas, and why today republicans will not tolerate Heroin pushers amongst the working class community. Funnily enough the 2 well known Brixton smack pushers, mysteriously turned up in Belfast, in the early 1990's, and spread Heroin addiction amongst working class lower ormeau residents, and the anarchist punk community. These 2 people operated with seemingly police immunity, driving about drunk after being disqualified, smacked up, yet the pigs took no notice of them, allowing them free reign in South belfast to obtain and sell smack. The female of this couple, whilst still a junkie and still taking smack, was training to be a probation officer, and in daily contact with vunerable kids, through her work as a youth club assistant. Yet these two operated with immunity from the law and the authorities why?. Is it any wonder or just pure coincidence that Ballymena, right wing DUP assembly man the Rev Ian Paisley's constituency is the new, SMACK CAPITAL of Ireland, why?, do right wing political parties promote heroin use amongst their working class people, why?, is it because they hate their working class poor people and they want to enslave and destroy their working class communities. Recent news paper articles are also linking notorious right wing ex NF commmander Johnny Adair's Uff, C company stronghold to smack pushers in Scotland and recent spate of smack pushing in the Lower Shankill and the Botanic area of Belfast, again why are these people allowing their working class communities to become addicted to smack, is it purely for financial gain, or are they being instructed to push Smack to working class communities by more sinister elements, such as the NIO. We the working class people of Belfast do not want our city turned into another Ballymena or Glasgow, but it would certainly suit the authorities, capitalists and establishment if our working class communities were destroyed,divided and ravaged by Heroin addiction.