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Poor Turnout for the English Defence League Demo

Pinkolady | 11.10.2009 14:41 | Anti-racism | Social Struggles | Liverpool

Considering it was meant to be a NATIONAL demonstration, The English Defence League's rally in the centre of Manchester on Saturday was unimpressive. If this motley collection of fascists and football hooligans thought they were going to spread their idea of 'English culture', they were sadly disappointed.



The EDL: pity they can't hold a tune
The EDL: pity they can't hold a tune

Anti racists penned inside Piccadilly Gardens
Anti racists penned inside Piccadilly Gardens

The EDL have been spotted
The EDL have been spotted

That Union Jack was a bit of a giveaway
That Union Jack was a bit of a giveaway



Letting the dogs out
Letting the dogs out



"They bite, y'know": copper states the obvious
"They bite, y'know": copper states the obvious


stand off
stand off


I set out for Piccadilly Gardens on the day intending to join the anti racist counter demo but I made the mistake of following a bunch of riot police along Oldham Street. I should have got ahead of them. When they reached the end of the road, they promptly lined up across it and blocked the way into Piccadilly Gardens.

I was left to prowl round the edges of the square, peering through the fences to see what was going on. Some of the EDL had been corralled into a corner by Debenhams. They were easy to find by the appalling noise they were making: "Land of Hope and Glory" simply does not work when done as a football chant.

There were no more than 300 EDL supporters for what was meant to be their national rally. The anti racist groups mustered nearly twice that many for what was only a north west regional call out. Nearly 100 anti racists turned out just from Liverpool. They occupied most of the lawn and fountain area of Piccadilly Gardens, leaving the EDL with nowhere much to go.

The police moved some of the EDL out of the square at one point and then let them back in again, where they were directly facing the anti racists. It is impossible to tell whether this was a deliberate provocation, or whether the police had decided they didn't want to risk the EDL having a chance to scatter into the backstreets of the Northern Quarter.

The EDL kept up the football style chanting until 5 o'clock, when the police moved them out of the area. But somehow a few of them went in the wrong direction, towards Portland Street, just as the police were letting the anti racist demonstrators out of that side of PIccadilly Gardens. One of the EDL yobs was reckless enough to shout a racist insult at some Asian lads who were standing nearby. Immediately 100 anti racists started to home in on his little gang.

The police then carried out one of their classic acts of stupidity, which raised tensions instead of defusing the situation. Two mounted police rode into the demonstrators while those on foot flailed their retractable batons at whoever was nearest to them. That simply cranked up the anger. Some one shouted, "Are you proud of protecting fascists?" Some one else threw a can at the EDL gang.

Then five dog handlers moved in to terrorise the anti racists and force them further down the street. They got quite carried away. I saw one of them threaten to set his dog on an Asian family who were walking along the pavement. They included an elderly lady and an 8-year-old girl. Another threatened to set his dog on a journalist who was standing in the road filming. I was using my own camcorder at the time. I trained it on the copper in question and advised him that if he set his dog on me I'd sue him - after I'd strangled his Alsation.

Meanwhile, the EDL supporters were standing across the street smirking at the upset they'd caused. They were shortly escorted away by their uniformed friends. And that was pretty much the end of the event.

This rally did nothing for the English Defence League's credibility, or their public profile. The ordinary shoppers who stopped to watch them only did so because they were an entertaining spectacle. Nobody seemed to know what they stood for, except that they were "the racists" they'd heard about in the news.

If the EDL had hoped to use this rally to promote their narrow version of English culture, they failed miserably.

Pinkolady
- Homepage: http://www.rightsandwrongsuk.blogspot.com

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Comments

Hide the following 18 comments

Are you blind??

11.10.2009 15:00

There was over 1,000 of them! Kindly bore someone else with you propaganda. These lies help noone.

Was there.


600 ish

11.10.2009 18:29

i recon there were 6 or 700 of them, around 1500 of us

Rory


Numbers-

11.10.2009 18:59

There were most decidedly no more than 300 EDL in attendance. The photos bear this out. There were less than this early on as well.

There are of course attempts to dispute this, but the points to bear in mind are that the EDL obviously inflate figures, and that indymedia is plagued by stormfront-esque trolls who attempt to spread disinformation.

James


Was there.

11.10.2009 20:12

Always good to hear cracking joke on Indy amongst the trolling!

sense of humour


'...after I'd strangled his Alsation.'

11.10.2009 22:03

Alright mate, nice work for getting out there and adding to numbers yesterday, but overtly advocating speciesism and animal abuse?

Just remember that the animals they use don't want to be there, and if they're 'set on you', it's because they've been trained to by the forces protecting the fascists, and by making such a vacuous comment, you're implying that you haven't considered the role in which humans (the police/state/whoever) exploit animals for our 'gain'.

I think it's time you made the connection between the way humans exploit animals, and the way humans supress other humans.

anti-speciesist
- Homepage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLQmYNsgKy0


Alarming numbers of the thugs

11.10.2009 22:31

I'm suprised by you saying this was a low turnout. If you look at their previous demos this seems to be their most attended by far. Possibly the biggest fash gathering in years?! I was in Manchester although didn't join the demo. I was disgusted to see so many EDL and sickened at the sorry site of so many hate filled thugs. It will be interesting to see where this 'movement' goes. Their philosophy seems all over the place. Hopefully these hate filled hooligans will turn on each other soon enough.

Dare I say something positive about the police on Indymedia?! The police did a great job containing them. I agree the use of dogs and horses is disgusting.

Ruby


Numbers of EDL

11.10.2009 22:58

You can see in this video that there are loads of them  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJvTr-mlaNY

Tod


Police

11.10.2009 23:15

You mentioned one of their stupid acts, well heres another one. Whilst they were trying to decide what to do with the EDL supporters they began to push and herd the 2000 UAF supporters down the narrow walkway through the fountain into Piccadilly Gardens, I stopped and asked one of the police had he ever heard of Hillsborough his response was "I can't hear you" and proceeded to push me along with the crowd. This I refused to do because of the sheer numbers of people being force to quickly move. I made a half-hearted attempt to comply then swung back and only entered the gardens a little later at one point that was not being guarded very well.

JoshuaKaitlyn
mail e-mail: joshuakaitlyn2008@yahoo.co.uk


Crowd Counting

11.10.2009 23:58

@Tod


Using some basic crowd counting techniques that both the police and demonstrators use - there were no more than 850 EDL demonstrators.

But it does show at least ten people giving fascist salutes. How does that square up with the "black" members?

Peter Todd


unfortunately, video's show otherwise...

12.10.2009 00:14

Don't get me wrong, I think there was high-points to the day - and the anti-fascist turn out was strong, but its crucial that we are realistic about how much of a success the day was.

Look at some of the videos put up on youtube. In this one -  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJvTr-mlaNY in looks like there's getting on for a thousand EDL - and they weren't just bussed away - they marched from piccadilly to victoria whilst a speaker from UAF made a ridiculous victory speech,.

Pretending the day was an all-out victory will just damage attempts to succesfully stop them in Leeds on the 31st, we will make the same mistakes again.

liverpool red


EDL? Extremely Dumb Lifestyle.

12.10.2009 02:40

English Defence League?

What??!!

Do they not realise that without Arabic culture we wouldn't have modern mathematics, surgery or astronomy, and thus as a result of this most of what we now consider to be contemporary 'Western' Science and technology?

In fact, the 'Renaissance' could not have happened without building upon the foundation of Arabic research and invention that went before it, itself having been expanded upon the works of ancient Rome, Greece and Babylonian culture. In fact, the first ever city state was sited in ancient Mesopotamia - we now call it Iraq, a long long way away from Ingurlund.

My point being that there is no such thing as 'pure' culture, least of all in this country, which has for centuries been the home to just about every race and denomination you can think of - we are a nation of immigrants, and to deny this is to deny our own history - yes, ENGLISH history, or is that Anglo-ish, perchance?

We after all a nation of Saxons, Normans, Vikings, Picts, Celts, Romanies, Romans, Africans, Asians, Balkans, Latinos, Japanese, Chinese and pretty much everything else, and a darn sight more 'integrated' than the USA too I'll wager, with asian and black schoolkids hanging out with their white counterparts and thinking nothing of it - it ain't no thing.

So, what exactly are the EDF trying to defend?

Some fictional ideal of a 'pure' English culture?

I have news for them - this world doesn't exist, never has existed and never will, and if their 'pure' culture did exist, life here would be a lot duller than it is.

You see, this Atheist has no problems at all with anyone believing whatever they like - you can be a Jedi Knight for all I care, but I do have a problem with people who have a problem with tolerating others' beliefs - that is after all, how wars start.

Cosmopolitan English Person...


Black EDL Members

12.10.2009 08:30

I only saw one black EDL supporter, but this just goes to show that stupidity isn't confined to just one race.

Anarchist


@ anti-speciesist

12.10.2009 09:29

What is it about the animal rights movement that makes its members try to ram their ideology into every damn thing?

Yes, the animals don't have any choice in being there - that doesn't alter the fact that they attack people, and when they do so, people are entirely justified in fighting back. Police use of animals is quite simply barbaric and should be brought to an end, but until it is, you can't really blame people for wanting to defend themselves.

anonymous


@ anonymous

12.10.2009 15:09

I'm ramming ideology?

Of course self-defense is necessary in such a situstion, but I was simply pointing that such banal comments about how we consider animals to be used by the state for our suppression isn't going to achieve anything, and suggested making the link between human and animal suffering & prejudices; this can't just be one struggle, protecting one community/population/species/race/minority/whoever.

anti-speciesist


@anti-speciesist

12.10.2009 17:04

I seems I may have over-reacted, in which case I apologise.

I really don't see the problem with the comment in question however - it was quite specific that the dog would only come to harm *if* it attacked the person in question, or in other words, in an act of self-defence. That has nothing to do with "speciesism" and everything to do with not wanting to get mauled by animals which the police - disgustingly - have turned into weapons.

Your last comment is the kind of mindset I'm wary of:

"this can't just be one struggle, protecting one community/population/species/race/minority/whoever."

Yes, it can. You may see all these issues as being linked but not everyone does, and to suggest you "can't" focus on human beings without also bringing animal rights into the equation does seem rather, well, dogmatic.

Again however, I recognise that I over-reacted to your message and apologise entirely.

anonymous


Ramming ideologies?

12.10.2009 20:46

"What is it about the animal rights movement that makes its members try to ram their ideology into every damn thing?"

Can anyone see the irony that anti-racists ram their ideology into every movement?
No? Just me who sees the positive ways used to bring about anti-fascism? Ok then...

By all means self-defence is a good thing, I just found your leading comment hilarious!

@ntispeciesist


Arabic != Muslim

13.10.2009 22:35

Nice post from Cosmopolitan English Person, but just to point out that Arabic and Muslim aren't the same thing. There are many non-Muslim Arabs and non-Arabic Muslims.

a


Inconvenient for the EDL

14.10.2009 13:06

Cosmopolitan English Person (in an excellent post) didn't mention Muslims or Islam at all. It is a fact, however, that the huge developments in mathematics, astronomy, medicine and other scientific and technical fields on which "western" technology is now based emerged in the Arabic world after the foundation of Islam, and to a large extent because of it. It was the Muslims who preserved the learning and thought of ancient Greece -of Plato, Aristotle and others- long forgotten and unknown in then largely illiterate Europe.

Another historical fact which the EDL might like to ponder is that thanks to the Roman armies of occupation, many Africans, Arabs and Balkan people lived on this island long before the arrival of the Jutes, Saxons and Angles, let alone the emergence of the word "English" ("Angle-ish") or a state of that name. Neither did all those people leave with the withdrawal of the Roman occupation and their influence on the Romano-Celtic civilisation which followed is still traceable, not only in archaeology and culture, but in "English" DNA.

Stroppyoldgit


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