Photos: Stop the War Demo Manchester 24th June

Has anyone got an available that don't involve having to sign up with bloody AOL?

I FUCKING HATE THOSE STW STEWARDS...PRETENTIOUS ARSEHOLES TRY AND TELL YOU WHAT YOU SHOULD BE DOING, ITS A PROTEST FOR CHRISSAKES!!

I don't think I'm prejudicing any future proceedings when I confirm that the '32 year-old man' will be suing the police for that outrageous arrest.

yep, knightrose, the stewards were little fascists and quite aggressive towards the people doing the sit-down. I think they kind of forget what a Protest is!!

"I'm told the STWC want the samba to stay away."

well, i say when the STWC wants you out, you know you are doing the right thing!

Sorry, STWC, but you can't control me ;-)

The planning and prep for this protest was shorter notice and smaller budget than the last one. I am on the STWC committee (not SWP) so when the call went out that they were short for stewards I thought "bugger it" and put myself forward.

I dont like the way STWC negotiates with the police as it is and saw up-front how a "leading" member took instructions from the police and passed them on to the front bunch of stewards.

We were told to pursuade anyone to move on who was sitting down etc. I just thought "I wont be doing that". In the event I didnt have to because I was up front the whole time.

On the other hand, other people on the march told me that alot of people didnt get the point of where and why the sit-down had taken place. You cant assume that people who just turn up on a march will telepathically know what is going on and why, or expect them to get on board if they dont know. Anarchy shouldnt be haphazard in these situations.

I think we perhaps could and should have charged the front bunch of police (there werent that many) near the bridgewater to attempt a blockade, it would certainly have got more meeja coverage and alarmed the labourscum a bit. But that sort of thing needs major planning and consensus. The vast majority of marchers arent expecting that sort of thing, arent prepared for it and might well not be willing to support it (right or wrong) Given that most marchers would never turn up to a meeting, join an affinity group or whatever and given that STWC is dominated by the SWP - it is hard to concieve how a SUCCESSFUL bit of mass DA could be arranged.

I got into a row with some SWPers because I at least wanted the arrests announced on stage. I said Id heard the of this word "solidarity". As I understand it, STWC did give some support to arrestees however, they can confirm or refute that.

In short, I shant be stewarding again - I felt used like an underling of an underling of the state.
Demos like this need huge organisation but there is a difference between telling the police (or not) what we intend to do and being told.

For better or worse STWC has the capacity to organise these large demos. Other people are welcome to have a try at the mass nationwide publicity, sourcing the money and speakers etc. but I doubt any other organisation could do it to that scale. If the STWC was disbanded thered have to be a similar organisation take its place and that too would run the risk of being SWP dominated. Sometimes the best way to stop SWP dominating these groups (Campaign Against Climate Change is another class example) is to try and balance up the numbers in steering groups. Might be a naive strategy I'll warrant. I have a lot of mixed feelings about all of this. Yesterday was nothing new I guess - you can always count on the "revolutionary vanguard" of the SWP to side with police over anarchists. SWP hate DA or anything beyond their control, its no secret.

the sit-down was spontaneous. It came out from our hearts and desperation for these "leaders" to hear us. Marching pass, did not re-assure us that the Labour party politicians would realise how much anger we have because the war is still going on. Because their decision has and is KILLING people. Therefore we decided to stay there, to make sure they heard us. To make sure we do not wish for them to take decissions for us. To show them that we do not approve of their decission but to also to shout to them that we wish for no leaders. Our only weapon is our voice, our music and soul. You should be angry with the ones shooting people not us trying to protect peace.

If the STWC wants us out because we want the War to stop then this is more than just ironic. The STWC should be welcoming diverse groups that have no hidden agendas- we just wish for the war to end, and for people to be equal to express themselves and protest. It seems to me, the STWC demos will be getting smaller and smaller as they become oppressive.

I respect the comrades that tried to take DA, it has become stupid that the STWC rolls over for the police when they are arranging a demonstration.

What gets me is that some people think that a small break away samba led march and sit down is direct action, it aint. The current state of the movement requires militants to engage with people on the demonstration not removing ourselves from the mass action. Some of you may have alot of anger and confidence to take confrontational action but the reality is, your an insignificant minority unless you attempt to work within the movement building the confidence of the movement to take such action.

You may moan about the events being SWP dominated, but leaving the main march really doesn't help that does it, and atleast the SWP are realistic of what can be achieved on these demonstrations in the current period. (im in SolFed BTW)

Chris S,

first of all we are NOT confrontational. The confrontational people were the ones being aggressive, not us.

Second, we never labelled what we did as "direct action"- we are not that big-headed. we simply did what spontaneously felt "right" to us.

As calling us insignificant...franlky, i do not agree. Insignificant are the people who always follow others. Insignificant are the people who stay with the masses. Insignificant are the people who do an A to B march to gain a vote. Insignificant are the people who belive the media and are so brainwashed to belive that everyone else is insignificant.

(Good luck with the movement - let me remind you the war is still on? Has the "movement" worked?)

No sitting down provokes a response from the police that is creating a confrontation.

being insignificant is staying part of the masses? wtf? those people are the only people who can change this society. Banging a drum and sitting on the floor is not going to change anything apart from giving the filth some more overtime, those people who march A to B are normal everyday people (not the SWP) for the most part, people who are against the war, if you think they are insignificant your deluded. ffs come back to reality, the movement has mobilised over 2 million people against the war, granted it lacked militant direct action, but thats why we have to work within that movement, swelling its ranks and building confidence, if you are unwilling to do that, if your happy banging your drums and going on a little sit down away from the demo because it felt "right" (whatever that means) then you will always remain an insignificant minority, which is about as much use to the anti war movement as a chocalate tea pot is for making tea.

Above is a perfect example by Chris S, of confronation and spreading dychotomy, just because a group did not obey him.

Unfortunately Chris S has once again missed the point. If Chris S thinks that a little sit down is "confronational" then maybe he should visit Iraq or Palestine.

As for "normal" people, are you implying we are ab-normal just because we had a mind of our own and did not obey you? Or is it that if anyone does something different than what YOU want should be oppressed or removed?

(expecting your aggro message)

love

sambista

Chris S, you seem fond of the "majority" and "normal" people who ever that is...let me remind you it is the majority who voted for the blood-thirsty leaders who send kids to war and kill people... because they know nothing different than following like sheep an A to B march while being bullied by people like you..

out of interest are you SWP?

if the samba band is so insignificant, then why are you so arsed about it? And if it was so insignificant then how come and you noticed it, and you are talking about it?

And why are you so arsed if a group of people decided to bang drums?
why is it your business?

hey dudes, Chris S is the person who always posts on Indymedia aggressive comments and calls any activity "stupid" etc. (Search Chris S in the indymedia search box)... the guy/woman sounds more SWP eventhough (s)he calls him/herself an "anarchist"...so don't take the comments to heart! :-)

good stuff

a lot of people ("normal" people as Chris S calls them) tried to join in in the die-in. Unfortunately the stewards were very aggressive towards these normal people who wanted to join in, and this resulted in the people leaving the die-in.

Maybe, stewards should start thinking of solidarity and unification and not to be so aggressive to the "normal" people who in fact wanted to sit down.

I cannot down the article to comment on it

re: sambista -

I expect no one to obey me, i will put forward my arguments, take them or leave them.

a sit down protest does provoke confrontation, you would need to be stupid not to see that.

Im not implying that your abnormal, im defending them because you consider them insignificant because they dont have your amazing politcal conciousness. I would not like to see anyone removed from stop the war events, i think the samba band is good on demos.

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re: Chris P

your not normal are you? you think your better than the majority of people?

and im not SWP, if you read the whole exchange you would see im a member of solidarity federation which is an anarcho syndicalist organisation.

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What im arguing for is for the anarchist left to participate more in the mass movement, and to engage that movement to work towards something better. If your not happy with the state of the anti war movement, sectioning yourselves off aint going to make the movement any better.

The spontaneous sit down was not seperate from the demo it was part of it and people on the demo who saw the sit down had a choice of joining in or not. In fact quite a lot of people who were not part of the samba band did join in for periods of time. The point is that the stewards were telling people not to join in and that the police were going to come down 'heavy,' they then in concert with the police began to direct the remainder of the demo around the sitdown on a different route from the origonal one, hoping to isolate the sit down. Chris, whose group ironically produces a journal titled 'Direct Action', is joining in with the Stop The War apparachiks in this attempt to isolate all those who refuse to go along with their opportunist pro-labour politics which have stifeled the anti-war movement.

Chris S, the only people who made the sit-down separate to the demo were the stewards who were aggressive to all people sitting down (who were the same people on the demo)

..and the only one who continues to separate the sit-down to the demo is you.

hey Chris S, if you are from the Solidarity Federation, why not show solidarity, rather than isolating a people who were part of the demo? This is excactly what the stewards did. They isolated the people, separated them from the demo and now you are also acting as if these people are outsiders or different. The sit down was people from the march who all sat down just to be abused by stewards.

(ps you still smell like an ex-SWP)