London Indymedia

Freecycle threaten to sue community group!

FennerFest | 13.11.2007 12:32 | Ecology | Globalisation | London

A Slough community-arts festival, FennerFest, included a "Freecycle: bring & take!" night, to celebrate the sharing & waste reduction ethos of the Freecyle movement - little did they know Freecycle is actually a private American company with trademarks, who turn the lawyers on anyone they don't like (eg us), and are also sponsored by a large American waste company!

this story featured in last week's Guardian as thus (tells you most of what you need to know):

 http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/nov/07/guardiansocietysupplement

"Toby Evans and friends organise a small community arts festival in Slough, and because some of them are ecologically minded they planned this year to include a "freecycle" event, where people bring along unwanted things and swap them to avoid waste and landfill. As Evans says: "We thought it might be nice to promote the Freecycle cause - chat, no money changing hands, cup of tea, like minds, all very harmless." But after they contacted the local Freecycle group, the organisation they believed was radical and community-spirited revealed itself as a legally avid American corporation, and refused to allow them to use Freecycle's name or logo. They were told: "I'd hate to have to ask our lawyers to intervene. . . If I don't hear from you by midnight I will be forced to report this to our lawyers for action." Yes, unbeknown to most of the million Brits who use Freecycle, it accepts money from America's biggest waste company and has purged itself of hundreds of groups that don't play by its rules. Evans has duly written back: "We are changing the name as requested - to the 'Not the Freecycle night: bring and take event'.""


-------------------------------------------------------

we had contacted the local Freecycle group in advance, not to ask for permission (because as it's clearly local people, including ourselves, voluntarily arranging to swap things amongst ourselves on a yahoo group, so it never occured to us that we needed to ), but to let the local people know we were running the event. We never heard anything back until the morning of the event:

--------------------------------------------------------------




---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Freecycle UK
Date: Nov 1, 2007 11:53 PM
Subject: Fennerfest and Freecycle
To:  slough4peace@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: South East


Dear Fennerfest organisers

Your festival, and the Freecycle event at it, have come to our
attention. It looks a really great festival. We unfortunately have some
concerns about the Freecycle event you are holding. We have no record of
permission being granted for this to be an official Freecycle event and
therefore you are not allowed to use our name or our logo for the event.
As you will see below, Freecycle and the Freecycle logo are trademarks
of The Freecycle Network and thus any use of the terms and logos for
events such as what you are advertising needs to be licensed. Perhaps
you could re-title the event a give and take event.

Sorry for being the bearer of bad news about this!!

Do you have any contact with the local Freecycle groups? If you were to
work with them there may be ways around this.

I'd hate to have to ask our lawyers to intervene therefore it would be
appreciated if you can sort this matter as soon as possible. If I don't
hear from you by midnight on Friday, I will be forced to report this to
our lawyers for action.

Many thanks

Neil Morris
Director
Freecycle UK

--
Freecycle UK is a Registered Charity (No. 1118148) and is a Company Limited by Guarantee (No. 05945013)
Copyright © 2003-2007 The Freecycle Network ( http://www.Freecycle.org). All rights reserved.
Freecycle and the Freecycle logo are trademarks of The Freecycle Network, CTM Reg. No. 4287553


----------------------------------------------------------------


we wrote back to them, told them that it was far too late to change any publicity, but if it made them happy, we could send out an email to everyone saying we were calling it "Not The Freecycle Night", and include their threat to explain why, but if they wanted to come to our event they were welcome, along with their lawyers

the night ran without problems, obviously. Someone got a luxury scrabble set. I got a James Taylor Quartet CD.

I contacted Freecycle to let them know that all went without trouble, and that John Vidal of the Guardian wanted to talk to them, & that Caroline Lucas (Green MEP) was also wanting to know what was going on, and they replied ...

--------------------------------------------------------------------




---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Freecycle UK
Date: Nov 5, 2007 12:23 AM
Subject: Re: Fennerfest and Freecycle
To: Slough4Peace
Cc: South East  summerstardreamer@tesco.yahoo.com


Hey I like your sentiment as well. However, if we had of managed to talk
earlier it would have been a simple case of working with the local
moderators and ensuring it was officially approved. I think it could
have been a really neat partnership. One of the real big issues for us
is the issue of public liability insurance for such an event. If it is
advertised, as a Freecycle event, it is conveying that we are organising
it and there is a strong possibility if something goes wrong the
organisation could get taken to court. I had sent my email in an
informal way in the hope that we could come to some arrangement quickly,
to get the appropriate licence to use the logo and make it into an
official Freecycle event in partnership knowing that appropriate public
liability insurance was in place and that the event met our criteria. I
would much prefer to enable things to happen rather than limit them.

Hope you understand.

Cheers

Neil

==========================================


health & safety, you see.

What I think happened is after we contacted the local group to let them know we were doing the night, somewhere along the line their communications broke down, & the UK director found out by some other means, eg google search, and didn't know we had already made contact

but what it shows that far from being the voluntary movement they come across as, they're far closer to a company like McDonalds when it comes to threatening legal action against people they think they can just intimidate into silence

there's loads on the web about it, if you're interested, and lots of other alternative networks emerging ....

FennerFest
- e-mail: slough4peace@yahoo.co.uk
- Homepage: http://www.fennerfest.co.uk/

Comments

Hide the following 7 comments

interesting

13.11.2007 21:07

this is interesting because there was a community event near here last week that had a freecycle fashion event that i imagine was "unapproved"

To be honest I can see their point. If they have registered the name and logo they are probably cautious about anyone using it. The letter was more polite than any other copyright letters i have seen.....

just a thought.

swale


No surprise

15.11.2007 11:58

That is a pretty low key contact from a supposedly MacDonald’s like corporation.

It’s appears to be only the name that has been copyrighted not the process and without getting too deep into it I assume that the Freecycle logo and name where both borne out of the States with both name and logo not being used in common until launched as a ‘brand’ for this network thing set up in 2003.

I have always known such concepts where people turn up and exchange goods as “swap meets!”

Still I see your point that it’s a pain in the ass. Something looks and seems fluffy with heaping of American goodness, cherries and apple pie. But when you scratch the surface its just another brand protecting its own and reverting to type.

Mat


passive-aggressive ...

16.11.2007 15:15

yeah, it was in polite language, and didn't go anywhere once we'd informed the Guardian, but it doesn't really sit right with the way the network actually works -- eg local people voluntarily working together for the common good. If they'd bothered to read their own email, they'd known in advance what we were up to (eg a celebration of the freecycle principle), rather than having to get the old legal threats out at the last minute


the question it raises for me is "Is Freecycle a Movement or an Organisation?"

I don't really think they know themselves yet, but it seems to me they're going to get themselves in a knot at some point, because they rely on independent networks of local people all communicating through a myriad of Yahoo Groups, but want to maintain themselves an independent body which accepts sponsorship to pay the wages of just a few people at the top.

FennerFest


i agree

16.11.2007 21:41

i agree with you. i would have been saying different things had the local event i was involved with had the same letters.:)

the fact that they depend on networks, active people like yourself and volunteers seems to run in conflict with a standard business/brand/copyright agenda.

in saying that, had any of the events been really bad or counter productive it would turn people off using freecycle - that where i can relate to the letter writers

swale


Freecycle and Charity

18.11.2007 16:48

Has there been any deterioration in what is available in Charity shops since Freecycle started in your districts? What used to be available to the most impoverished at a price they might afford is now given away for free to those who are rich enough to be on the web with a computer.

The Rich get richer and the Poor live poorer.

Ilyan


charity shops

19.11.2007 22:37

not really. lots of the stuff given on freecycle is stuff that isn't sold through charity shops and is often put on by people who wouldn't give things to charity shops anyway.

also, i don't see how getting stuff free on freecycle is more expensive than a charity shop. Spend £1 in an internet cafe and you could get a suite of furniture. You probably save on transport too.



swale


right idea, wrong method

20.11.2007 11:16

I totally agree that they need to keep an eye on what's done under "their" name (though if it's really "their's" is another question, both legally and morally) ... I can see why they wouldn't want people setting up jumble sales & charging people to get in, but we felt that there's a time and a place for lawyers, and this just wasn't it. That they were so quick to threaten that, rather than start a discussion/follow up on our initial contact, gives the impression that they're, well, a bit sinister & out of touch

perhaps its just the American Way ...

FennerFest


Kollektives

Birmingham
Cambridge
Liverpool
London
Oxford
Sheffield
South Coast
Wales
World

Other UK IMCs
Bristol/South West
London
Northern Indymedia
Scotland

London Topics

Afghanistan
Analysis
Animal Liberation
Anti-Nuclear
Anti-militarism
Anti-racism
Bio-technology
Climate Chaos
Culture
Ecology
Education
Energy Crisis
Fracking
Free Spaces
Gender
Globalisation
Health
History
Indymedia
Iraq
Migration
Ocean Defence
Other Press
Palestine
Policing
Public sector cuts
Repression
Social Struggles
Technology
Terror War
Workers' Movements
Zapatista

London IMC

Desktop

About | Contact
Mission Statement
Editorial Guidelines
Publish | Help

Search :