Friends meeting house on Euston road was almost filled by delegates from across Britain eventhough Britain is no longer engaged in an overt War in Iraq (well Bush did declare the war was over). So in a sense the STWC must redefine its purpose otherwise its local groups will disband, as they did after the first Gulf war, to wait for the next US imperialist War.
The second national Peoples Assembly called by Stop The War Coalition (STWC)in London last Saurday may not have been as well attented as the First earlier this year, but it resulted in more than just slogan's or demands to government that is not prepared to listen to the voice of the left liberals, , trade unionists, peace campaigners, and a range of Leninist based parties
To a large extent the STWC has disappeared from a network that was at one stage the largest in Britain to a few score small monthly meetins around the country.
There had been an opportunity to develope the STWC into something permanent expanding it to campaign against the wider effects of neo-liberalism, but this opportunity has been lost. The idea of developing these groups into local social forum was stamped on by STWC largest contituent - the SWP, who have a dispoportionate amount of control over the whole organisation (They can bully or sweet talk the liberals into doing wwhat they want).
It is likely that the STWC national demo on Sept 29 in London will be a pale shadow of this years 2 million strong event, but not necessarily so.
Admirably, the coalition is promoting Non Violent Direct Action, and is hoping to intervene through another arm of the SWP - Globalise Resisitance at DESi, which is a promising move for this Organisation that is calling actions in many parts of Europe.
Throughout the assmbly ( or more accurately, rally) film past and present US/UK imperialist wars was projected above the stage, full of statisitcs which show the extent of murder and genocide commited by the US and UK. This set a tone that concentrated the mind on the enemy.
There were some some surprising amendments to motion, the SWP favouring an immediate withdrawal of troops and the UN, to leave the country to the Iraquia ti fight it out between themselves - this sort of policy would be more acceptable to Anarchists, but many of the Liberal - lefts and more commonsense-minded were nodding heads as the SWP tub star tub-thumper spoke powerfully against any UN presence at all.
One of the more bizare moments was when a young Edinburgh SWP comrade accused local Direct Action activists/anarchist of sabotage because they were organising actions in Endinburg to co-incide with the sept. 29 Natiional London Demo in London. She declared that soon a [Leninist]central committee would be set to sort out these people who, she stated:'are meeting in secret' (because they dont want the cops to know silly).
I believe that I was the only person in the Hall to laugh at this idiocy which was worrying. It did not dawn on this girl, or the rest of those present, that Scotland is a separate country, and that nice middle class girls like her might be able to afford the coach fare and back to London and have all the time in the world for trips to the capital, but poorer working people or the unemployed cannot.
John Pilger was the Star turn, and received almost as big an ovation as, George Galoway did at the last STWC national gathering - and aguably deservedly so.
Pilger told us some intersesting snipets from his new film - he continues to uncover the murky doings of our so called deomcratic government with comendable skill. This guy's is big enough not to have to suck up in any way or compromise with the Britsh Establisment which he says rules the country, not these elelected monkeys we call MPs ( bar a few dozen notable exceptions of course - an excuse me for insulting monkeys so grossly).
Pilger seemed to get confused over whether the US neo-conservatives were fasicsts or not, or what the word itself meant at all, but he quoited some a US statsman who reconned they might be. Luckily this sort of ambiguity doesn't slip into his journalistic work.
A little disappointed was a motion comdemming social forum (SWP inspired) whic was a bit meaningless since they dont really exist in an concrete from yet, and unlikely to with the left trots and liberals opposing them. I really dont think these people know what they are supposed to be anyway. London Social Forum has not yet been founded (Oct 4) so the SWP were nipping this bit - of what could be something that they just dont have the resources to control - in the bud.
The SWTC is obviously struggling now to maintain itself, but the Peoplkes Assemble should give it a second wind ( or gentle breeze in reality) but it is bound to peter out until the US launces another imperialist war, and that will not happen for another year - the US as well as the SWP are short of resources too - both of which some of which us are thankfull for.
(sorry no time to proof read this before posting)
Ed C.
To a large extent the STWC has disappeared from a network that was at one stage the largest in Britain to a few score small monthly meetins around the country.
There had been an opportunity to develope the STWC into something permanent expanding it to campaign against the wider effects of neo-liberalism, but this opportunity has been lost. The idea of developing these groups into local social forum was stamped on by STWC largest contituent - the SWP, who have a dispoportionate amount of control over the whole organisation (They can bully or sweet talk the liberals into doing wwhat they want).
It is likely that the STWC national demo on Sept 29 in London will be a pale shadow of this years 2 million strong event, but not necessarily so.
Admirably, the coalition is promoting Non Violent Direct Action, and is hoping to intervene through another arm of the SWP - Globalise Resisitance at DESi, which is a promising move for this Organisation that is calling actions in many parts of Europe.
Throughout the assmbly ( or more accurately, rally) film past and present US/UK imperialist wars was projected above the stage, full of statisitcs which show the extent of murder and genocide commited by the US and UK. This set a tone that concentrated the mind on the enemy.
There were some some surprising amendments to motion, the SWP favouring an immediate withdrawal of troops and the UN, to leave the country to the Iraquia ti fight it out between themselves - this sort of policy would be more acceptable to Anarchists, but many of the Liberal - lefts and more commonsense-minded were nodding heads as the SWP tub star tub-thumper spoke powerfully against any UN presence at all.
One of the more bizare moments was when a young Edinburgh SWP comrade accused local Direct Action activists/anarchist of sabotage because they were organising actions in Endinburg to co-incide with the sept. 29 Natiional London Demo in London. She declared that soon a [Leninist]central committee would be set to sort out these people who, she stated:'are meeting in secret' (because they dont want the cops to know silly).
I believe that I was the only person in the Hall to laugh at this idiocy which was worrying. It did not dawn on this girl, or the rest of those present, that Scotland is a separate country, and that nice middle class girls like her might be able to afford the coach fare and back to London and have all the time in the world for trips to the capital, but poorer working people or the unemployed cannot.
John Pilger was the Star turn, and received almost as big an ovation as, George Galoway did at the last STWC national gathering - and aguably deservedly so.
Pilger told us some intersesting snipets from his new film - he continues to uncover the murky doings of our so called deomcratic government with comendable skill. This guy's is big enough not to have to suck up in any way or compromise with the Britsh Establisment which he says rules the country, not these elelected monkeys we call MPs ( bar a few dozen notable exceptions of course - an excuse me for insulting monkeys so grossly).
Pilger seemed to get confused over whether the US neo-conservatives were fasicsts or not, or what the word itself meant at all, but he quoited some a US statsman who reconned they might be. Luckily this sort of ambiguity doesn't slip into his journalistic work.
A little disappointed was a motion comdemming social forum (SWP inspired) whic was a bit meaningless since they dont really exist in an concrete from yet, and unlikely to with the left trots and liberals opposing them. I really dont think these people know what they are supposed to be anyway. London Social Forum has not yet been founded (Oct 4) so the SWP were nipping this bit - of what could be something that they just dont have the resources to control - in the bud.
The SWTC is obviously struggling now to maintain itself, but the Peoplkes Assemble should give it a second wind ( or gentle breeze in reality) but it is bound to peter out until the US launces another imperialist war, and that will not happen for another year - the US as well as the SWP are short of resources too - both of which some of which us are thankfull for.
(sorry no time to proof read this before posting)
Ed C.
e-mail:
Comments
Hide the following 16 comments
Join the SWP
01.09.2003 18:21
Join the SWP
Join the SWP
Join the SWP
Join the SWP
district organiser
how do you know this little girl was middle class?
01.09.2003 19:45
and nasty attacks on this girl what evidence is there that she was middle class? i travelled from dundee the for the 1st meeting and was subsidised the bus cost me a £5 return.
Why do people jump to such opinions it ruins your argument and makes you obviously biased but of course you will now accuse me of being middle class.
I would have thought it more sensible if london and edinburgh demos were on different days like what was done last year with the glasgow demo in oct and london in sept both got seperate and large coverage in the news as thats the point of them and that gave a presence at both.Yes scotland is a seperate nation and the quicker independance the better but the power at the moment is in westminster not holyrood.
edinburgh rock
Good report
01.09.2003 21:01
As for the Demo (30th of Sept?), I don't think it will be big. Hopefully there will be a good free party to go to afterwards to make it worthwhile. :)
Zz
Homepage:
http://www.agp.org
bits to correct
01.09.2003 21:41
"One of the more bizare moments was when a young Edinburgh SWP comrade accused local Direct Action activists/anarchist of sabotage because they were organising actions in Endinburg to co-incide with the sept. 29 Natiional London Demo in London. She declared that soon a [Leninist]central committee would be set to sort out these people who, she stated:'are meeting in secret' (because they dont want the cops to know silly)"
the only thing to co-incide with the demo in London is a boring rally where the usual speaker will rant away for hours in the name of ego and self-appraisal with their usual superficial manipulating propaghanda. Clearly this can be neither described as sabotage nor as direct action, instead it will incide everybody to yawn themselves away.
And the meetings are not in secret, they are usual at 7.30pm the first or second wednesdays a month somewhere.
But of course, the SWP doesn't know what dignity towards each other is and just keeps on stabbing their evil comrades in the back if they don't get to make the decision locally voluntarily which they want to see in London.
Anyway I look forward to seeing a Leninist Central Committee in Edinburgh.
This clearly sounds like fun to me. ;-)
Hopefully more people than realise what scam this party is and change over to something more usefull, even such NGOs such as Amnesty International, Friends of the Earth, Oxfam and even the Green party do a better job than these party heads.
If you don't want to do something too radical but still be effective, better participate in these human rights groups instead of the socialist party ego tribe.
oops
Class - are you with us or against us; or has your sense of humour gone AWOL?.
02.09.2003 07:56
This is meant to be a newswire so excuse me for this posting, my email address is above if you want a discussion.
First, I do see the constructive criticism in your comment.
Secondly, let me say that I was kicked off an Internet point at our central library before finishing or give my report the most cursory of pre-posting perusals, but that’s no excuse for inaccuracy.
I used the term ‘middle classes not in a pejorative sense, but as a bourgeois socio-economic category. It wasn’t the Edinburgh lass’s ’posh’ accent or ability to visit London so frequently that was sufficient to imply this, but the silk floral blouse purchased at Liberties London that she sported coloured my thinking.
As far as class goes I am sure all those present at the Peoples Assembly were working class in the general sense that we are not part of the ruling class or their backers (and supporters which includes many brainwashed working class). The question is whether Jeremy Paxman is working class or not - he lies on the borderline.
I like this definition, and picked it from King of the working class: Arthur Scargil. Of course within this definition there are sub-categories most importantly the oppressed and exploited class of workers.
Admittedly, as Edinburghrock pointed out, by subjective flippancy probably has lowered the level of my posting but perhaps she or anyone else out there with excess funds could make a contribution to sending me on a course in journalism. Then perhaps I wouldn’t use slang or flippancy.
One thing is very important to say humour is a very important part of struggle - it can shake of the fear and sustain one through difficult times and situations, and sometimes it can reveal far more than any dry academic article.
I re-read Lenin’s state and revolution recently, and found not one iota of intended humour in it, but it did make me laugh a little. It is a poor book, but at the time convinced the Bolsheviks, by using repetition and bullying language. The book itself is at worst a rant. A rant to be obeyed by the followers.
Lenin does not clearly say that the state needs to be smashed - this is the point at which i would depart and is the premis underlying his whole book. The state does need to be quickly liquidated and by subsumed into a real naturally, democratic contruct which is not institutonalised so it can be controlled by a bullying elite who believes it has all the answers.
State and revolution is intended to restrict and inhibit the thinking of the reader or follower, and it did do that. It lacks any kind of logical analysis to justify the conclusions: the replacement of the dictatorship of the Bourgeoisie by the dictatorship of the proletariat. It repeated dismisses Anarchists and Anarchy in a very crude way, similar in the way Tony Blair would do it now. Lenin, and the state know that Anarchists arte the real threat to their power - the oppressors love to have power over others to tell them and dictate to them their lives, whilst they adopt a privileged life-style riding on the shoulders of the working class.
So when the Edinburgh lass talks about central committees in Edinburgh for the SWP that’s a laugh and should be fun, but there is also something insidious that could grow out of it if these committees abstained real power over a class of people. That is not something spoken about, but the central committee, as an organisational instrument is great if you like that sort of thing - I do not. I do not like institutionalised hierarchies because they create a bureaucracy that can be manipulated by the few to lord it over the many.
So lighten up and save your anger and hatred for the state and not for a silly joke made by me.
Love and peace
Ed c.
Edward Campbell
e-mail:
ep@epcampbell.fsnet.co.uk
The real date of the demo
02.09.2003 11:23
The demo is actually on the 27th! And if you don't believe me, go to:
www.stopwar.org.uk
Hope anyone who can make it makes it, otherwise I'll be wishing you the greatest of success in your local demonstrations/actions.
Avanti!
Mad Monk
er
02.09.2003 11:37
Glad to see the SWP bashers have not got all confused about who the real enemy is, who is worried about Blair and Bush eh?
Sonic
who's afraid of a little discussion?
02.09.2003 21:37
> real enemy is, who is worried about Blair and Bush eh?
I don't think it's losing sight of who the real enemies are just to
remind ourselves what the SWP et al are up to...
I mean, it's not as if we're organising NVDA blockades and sitdowns
of the SWP's next AGM or whatever :) We're just having a discussion.
You're not afraid of discussion, are you?
anon
The Real Enemy?
02.09.2003 22:55
X
Not afraid of sensible discussion no
03.09.2003 10:41
Sonic
Hey ho
03.09.2003 17:05
(A minor gripe: you expected the SWP to support a UN role in Iraq? Jesus, if you're going to criticise somebody, at least learn something about them first...)
Personally, I thought the People's Assembly kicked arse. More please.
gibbon77
Gibbon77's numbers are wrong
03.09.2003 18:53
i must post this information to correct it, otherwise, i wouldnot have been interested in putting out this information especially when many swp comrades are working really hard
i am a former member of the swp, and left the organisation last year. i was present at the london office when membership data was collated last year
the active membership of the SWP in January 2002 was 1,780, but many of that number did not pay subscriptions. The SWP probably has about 650 subscription members now, and the number is decreasing still decreasing steadily. the organisation was in financial crisis last year
they have no membership to speak of in Wales, or now even Scotland.
these are just plain and simple facts
my opinion for what it is worth is that there are many good comrades in the swp but the leadership is degenerate politically and personally. they will do anything to maintain the profile of the organisation stopping short of murder. but they have been known to talk about harassing some guy until he commits suicide. i know someone who knows about this and will try to find out more
once the swp has collapsed all this stuff will come out. many comrades who have left do not want to destroy them politically because they are after all on the left.
but it is sad to say that the swp are a real scam, and employ some of the most incredible obnoxious and bullying tactics to discredit anyone who kicks their arse politically.
there are many cases where they have used young female comrades as bait to provoke sexual harassment charges, and also to provoke violent reactions.
i wish the SA, StopT.W. but things are not looking good for them. they should be able to recruit out of Gobalerwise Resistance project. if they do not it’s a tough winter ahead for them.
gibbons77 but i suggest you go to head office and check your figures because its silly you mislead people
all the best gibbons77 good luck with the esf and the rest, but i have to end with saying there are some real odd people running the swp. remove them and the swp could take off again and this time be a positive proposition and first stop for student activists.
dave
er (part 276)
04.09.2003 10:36
Cue X-files music.........
Sonic
hmm
04.09.2003 12:07
Even rival Trot groups say the SWP have thousands of activists, maybe not 10,000 but getting on for it. Even SCHNews say so! Or are they an SWP front too?
I agree with that comment a few weeks back, some anti-SWP comments on here sound like lovesick teenagers, "I hate them I hate them I hate them, why won't they notice me?"!
sceptical
A rule of thumb to calculate the membership of a Group
04.09.2003 13:22
Let number of branch meetings nationally (from party newspaper) = N
Let A = (average attendance)/branch
Membership = (N*A + 1,000 lazy b's) * 2 { double it for good measure)
= (90 * 10 + 1000 ) * 2 ( I counted 63 in the paper I have, but rounded up to 90 because they do not publicise all there meetings)
= 3,800 is the upper limit (900 is lower limit)
The same calculation for Workers Power = 35 25 mimimum
And for the socialist Party = 420 maximun 220 minimum.
Have you every seen more than 300 swp members at a national demo in the last five years. The left in Britain is small so relatively big is tiny.
It is not the quantity that matters, it is the qulaity.
stato
Numbers
05.09.2003 16:07
Sonic