why young people - are you ageist ? Old folks not cool enough for your constellation. Good to split people up through age etc you fascist.

> why young people - are you ageist ? Old folks not cool enough for your constellation. Good to split people up through age etc you fascist.

Maybe because old people are negative, not forward thinking, demoralising and seem to lecture the young on how to do things and how they know better?

Indymedia should not be the place for bigotted ageist comments.

The promotion of an event which excludes older people is bad enough, To allow comments which re-enforce such discrimination is wholly unacceptable. The test is whether this would be acceptable if 'young' was replaced with 'able bodied', 'male' or 'white'.

hi,

i totally agree with the complaints made, this sounds like a great idea and in my experience passionate people come from all age groups, and yeah there are problems with people lecturing others but we can get over that....this project should deffo examine its own unthought through prejudices as it means less people will be involved....

i'll try and make it down from the big smoke cheers! rich

> Maybe because old people are negative, not forward thinking, demoralising and seem to lecture the young on how to do
> things and how they know better?

I find your attitude negative, not forward thinking, demoralising and seeming to lecture the old on how to do things and that you know better!

How about you take your dismissive and offensive generalisations and look in the mirror

Indymedia is supposed to be against all forms of discrimination? Please take this ageist article down

It's not necessarily ageist - projects all over the place focus on one particular group whilst other groups have broader targets. If it had criticised older people and negatively excluded them that would be different, but without that negative exclusion I don't think it's the same as discrimination. Are women's health projects discriminatory towards men, for example? Of course, if they did exclude old people for negative reasons then that would be discriminatory, but let's not judge too quickly.

So MG "Not necessarily ageist" - this groups needs to explain and justify why they are discriminating agaisnt "old people" in favour of "young people" (whatever they mean by that?)

"So MG "Not necessarily ageist" - this groups needs to explain and justify why they are discriminating agaisnt "old people" in favour of "young people" (whatever they mean by that?) "

No they don't. People do and should continue to have the freedom to do what they want without persecution from others.

The article says "...is a constellation of young people..."
This is simply a statement of fact.

If you pointed at a group of young people and said "there is a group of young people",.... how can that be ageist!!!!!!!!

If this group is made up of young people, then it is a trueful fact that it is a constellation of young people. I mean - what is your fucking problem with this?

I think you are being too sensitive and need to get a thicker skin if you are upset that there are groups of young people doing things.

Seriously, do you not realise how alienating this sounds? When you describe yourselves solely as a group of young people it makes it sound like you wouldn't be welcoming to older people joining or wouldn't value their contribution.

And "grow a thicker skin" is what misogynists say to avoid dealing with their shit when confronted with their own sexism.

fair point.

"grow a thicker skin" means sick of having to be politically correct and tread around on eggshells trying to keep everyone happy and almost thinking "is it actually worth bothering?"

If you are going to get sensitive and demanding over things like this - people are going to avoid you

the point is not that it's a description of fact, but that it's an open group that welcomes involvement...except if you're old(er).

I think it comes from some idealogical/media slant that Plane Stupid used too, rather than being a description of fact.

To paint this as self-determination (as with women's spaces, which I fully support) is blurring reality.

Hello,
thank you for your comments and criticism, even though not always formulated with a lot of solidarity as I felt.
I will repost what another person wrote on the Bristol IMC site:
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I need to go back to the rather elegant and comprehensive RTF manifesto to be sure of this, but my understanding is that RTF came out of a specifically youth meeting of La Via Campesina in Europe, which was created because they already have an 'adults' branch for those who are already proper peasants, rather than merely aspiring to be so.

RTF emerged as an independent organization because it wanted to operate on anarchist principles, as opposed to the more unionized structures favored by La Via Campesina internationally. The youth aspect (if it is indeed still part of the manifesto, I'm not certain) was retained as a space for those without access land yet, or with limited skills, as much as anything else.

I'm a phogey who fits that bill, and as someone who was far from the oldest person there at the first UK RTF meeting in London earlier in the year I wouldn't worry.

Which leaves the question, when is it starting? I can't find times anywhere. Letting folk know a muster time for tomorrow might help with accessibility. Nice one to all those who've put energy into getting this sorted mind, it's appreciated.

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So much for the background of the "youth" identitiy, also RtF has long agreed to remove this from the "who we are" text, just our minds are sometimes quicker than our keyboards and we are reproducing the same agist text all over, but we will get it fixed, promise!
also I feel it is important to stress that at RtF Meetings, Assemblys, Camps, etc. people of all ages have been present, will be present and should be present, we are not in any way trying, wanting or wishin to exclude people who are "old", whatever that does mean anyway.
Hope this can hold as an answer,
all the best,
a reclaiming person