Tell me, who is the terrorist?!
John F. Dupret | 25.03.2011 21:38 | Globalisation | History | Terror War | Cambridge
Two days ago, on March 22nd 2011, the Israeli army attacked a populated area in the Al-Shejaija neighborhood, east of Gaza City. Four days after the murder of two children in Johr Al-Dik, the Israeli army once again killed civilians, amongst them two more children. The latest victims of Israel’s war crimes are Yasser A’ahid Al-Helo (15), Mohamed Jalal Al-Helo (10), Mohammed Shaber Harara (18) and Yasser Hamid Al-Helo (55). At approximately 3 pm, Israeli tanks, positioned along the border, hit Al-Nazzaz street, 2 km from the border with four consecutive artillery shells. The first one hit Samer Walid Mushtaha’s house, destroying the upper floor. His wife, who was preparing dinner, had just gone downstairs and missed the attack by chance. The second shell hit vacant land nearby belonging to the Al-Helo family. The third one hit a group of children and older boys who were playing football near their houses, as they do every single day. 10 year old Mohamed Jalal Al-Helo and 19 year old Mohamed Saber Harara were immediately killed and their bodies brutally dismembered. Ten more children and an adult were also injured by shrapnel.
ISM - Gaza
Three year old Yasser A’amer Al-Helo and six year old Ahmad Talal Al-Helo are currently in the Intensive Care Unit of the hospital with severe injuries.Yasser Hamed Al-Helo and his 15 year old grandson Yaser Ahed Al-Helo were opening the garage door to take out the car and rescue the wounded when they were hit by the fourth shell. They were killed on the spot.
This was the third attack on Al-Shejaija that day. At 10 am artillery fire injured one person and later in the morning another was reported to have been critically wounded by a drone strike.
Yesterday morning, Israeli military sources were quoted on Israeli radio as stating that one of the shells veered off and caused casualties. However, these four shells targeted a civilian area therefore civilian casualties were to be expected. According to witnesses, not one, but two different shells caused the deaths of these four civilians. ...........
http://palsolidarity.org/2011/03/17175/ ........... Since the 2nd Intifada, seven people of the Al-Helo family have been killed by Israeli attacks. During Operation Cast Lead, tanks shelled a house, killing Foa’ad (55), his son Mohammed (25) and Mohammed’s two year old daughter Farrah. The bodies could only be evacuated after three days.
“I just wish you would tell the world we’re not terrorists. We’re just unlucky that we don’t have oil, otherwise the US would support the Palestinian cause for sure”, says Ra’aid Al-Helo, one of the family members. http://palsolidarity.org/2011/03/17175/
This was the third attack on Al-Shejaija that day. At 10 am artillery fire injured one person and later in the morning another was reported to have been critically wounded by a drone strike.
Yesterday morning, Israeli military sources were quoted on Israeli radio as stating that one of the shells veered off and caused casualties. However, these four shells targeted a civilian area therefore civilian casualties were to be expected. According to witnesses, not one, but two different shells caused the deaths of these four civilians. ...........
http://palsolidarity.org/2011/03/17175/ ........... Since the 2nd Intifada, seven people of the Al-Helo family have been killed by Israeli attacks. During Operation Cast Lead, tanks shelled a house, killing Foa’ad (55), his son Mohammed (25) and Mohammed’s two year old daughter Farrah. The bodies could only be evacuated after three days. “I just wish you would tell the world we’re not terrorists. We’re just unlucky that we don’t have oil, otherwise the US would support the Palestinian cause for sure”, says Ra’aid Al-Helo, one of the family members.
http://palsolidarity.org/2011/03/17175/
John F. Dupret
Comments
Hide the following 23 comments
Let me help you with your quandary
25.03.2011 23:20
Reality Check
Reality Check = Waffen SS
26.03.2011 01:39
But how does a massacre of the local populace constitute a "necessitated defence" against terrorism?
Under international law, proportionality is demanded, Israel cannot claim to be a special case under international law so has an obligation to act proportionately, which it cannot do because it has no interest in international law.
It doesn't matter what the Palestinian's do, Israel is always going to act illegally.
Juntwalder
@reality check
26.03.2011 01:57
Never heard such a winging pathetic excuse for an argument before!
Useless penis!
anon
reality check 2
26.03.2011 08:39
Israel said these were in response to militant rocket attacks.
If the militants stopped firing rockets at Israel then Israel wouldn't shoot back.
Its not exactly rocket science (excuse the pun)
matt
@reality check & matt
26.03.2011 10:15
Totally agree with Matt and Reality check.
If they stopped firing rockets at our glorious nation of Israel then we wouldn't have to slaughter them.
The problem with Indymedia is that it doesn't get that Israel is the fatherland and we are its stormtroppers. We obey the great leaders and will do whatever it takes to realise our great dream of racial purity and preservation of our superior bloodline.
There must be no Palestinians left after we have finished, we must have all the land. Even if the Palestinians are peaceful, even if they are accepting of our behaviour, we know that they must still prostrate themselves before us in complete subservience to our aims of creating the greater fatherland. Even if they intend to resist our dominance, that will be enough for us to slaughter them. We know that violence is the only way. We have learned from history that the only thing the world listens to, is violence.
Above all, we must provoke the Palestinians into violence in order that we may hide our agenda from view, in our march toward a greater Israel, we must always take what we need by convincing the world we are just defending ourselves. It is easier for our fellow stormtroop in the UK and US to make our case, if they are defending us, defending ourselves.
The Palestinians must always be made to be the architects of their own downfall. There is no other way to achieve racial purity or the expansion of the glorious fatherland.
Jacob
Nobody biting, Israel = evil.
26.03.2011 10:18
That's because you ARE reality check.
Useless penis!
anon
What is is really like living in Israel.
26.03.2011 10:54
I am Jewish and have lived in Israel for almost ten years. My family returned in Israel in 1987 but left and returned again to the UK in 2006. We couldn't stand it any more. We couldn't stand the violence, the lying we were 'expected' to do. We couldn't stand the excusing of violence by our newspapers and TV, the cheating and corruption. Above all, we couldn't stand the people, they were awful, selfish, mean and incredibly arrogant and conceited.
What I see on TV here in the UK is exactly the behaviour I would expect given the people I met. In Israel there is no fairness, no compassion, no tolerance. Even the academics and teachers come across as extreme and partisan. The IDF soldiers who stand around all day in the street, they are the worse. You walk past them and you wonder what they have done that day. You can see on their faces the hatred they have in them. While we lived in Israel, we heard about what the IDF were getting up to on a daily basis. You hear it all the time, IDF changing out of their uniforms and going into the fields to beat up the crop hands working for the Arabs, or anyone else they can find. I saw with my own eyes a group of four IDF changing into jeans and tee-shirts and taking iron bars with them into a car before driving off. I heard the next day through my neighbour, that two Arabs had been attacked and one had been beaten with bars across the shin bones. You hear these things all the time. It never stops.
The whole thing is a lie. Everyone in Israel only pulls the line because they worry what will happen if the money stops arriving from abroad.
I live in the UK now and will never go back. The people in this country have given me so much. They are family to me now. The English are angels compared to the people I lived alongside in Israel.
F David.
Our sympathies.
26.03.2011 11:24
Vi Chapman
Horrible wars
26.03.2011 11:33
This is truly awful. A three year olf child FFS!!!
So where is the British ConDem coalition humanitarian war to intervene here to stop 3 year old children being brutalised and teenagers being killed outright with heavy weapons? When will we be carrying out air-strikes against the artillery that's being used to commit these awful crimes against humanity.
Laurie and Tina, Manchester
reality check
26.03.2011 12:08
This isn't possible. Shells are not guided, they don't veer off. They go where they are fired. They are like bullets.
They landed at the position they were aimed at
Anon
Define "proportional"
26.03.2011 12:27
Or are you calling the reposnse not proportional because the results are so different? Different because the Israelis aim instead of firing at random. Sorry, but Gaza is densely populated so if the Israelis closed their eyes and fired off their rounds just aimed in the general direction we would be seeing a HIGHER percentage of civilian (collateral) casualties relative to the number of fighters hit.
Try going back over the casualty figures. Seems like the Israelis are hitting the fighters about 50% and possibly higher if you adjust for the more questionable "civilians". Thus going out to the site of the launcher to recover wounded fighters (and possibly the launcher or mortar) isn't strictly speaking "collateral civilian".
We need to consider OBJECTIVES. What exactly are the resistance fighters trying to do by firing off rounds without aiming? Surely not to hurt Israelis as that is a very ineffective way to go about it. Are they just trying to compete for INTERNAL support among the Palestinians. Draw return fire so the population will side with them rather than with moderates who want some kind of settllement?
MDN
wrong
26.03.2011 12:52
Bullshit. The PGS (precision guidence systems) for artillery which is just under development can bring it to 50m accuracy in tests. Artillery used to be more accurate that rocket systems until they incorporated smart systems. You've got things like wind, humidity and basic slight defects in the barrel and shell contributing to inaccuracy. Do some basic research.
ed
Israeli loyalist propaganda
26.03.2011 14:01
No, that's febrile idiocy that can only come from an internet ignoramus. There is as much smartness about shellfire as there is in your head.
Your a complete buffoon and you can't tell shit from shoe polish.
These shells were directly targeted to cause civilian loss of life. No doubt those who planned this criminal act decided on a deliberate accident. It happens all the time in the bullshit world of Israeli military/media/political propaganda.
Idiot!!
anon
Hasbara junk
26.03.2011 14:13
No, you are trying to suggest that
"Or are you calling the reposnse not proportional because the results are so different? Different because the Israelis aim instead of firing at random."
You said it!!!! Clumsy fucker!
"Try going back over the casualty figures. Seems like the Israelis are hitting the fighters about 50% and possibly higher if you adjust for the more questionable "civilians". Thus going out to the site of the launcher to recover wounded fighters (and possibly the launcher or mortar) isn't strictly speaking "collateral civilian"."
Well, I don't understand how you reason this logic out, but then I wouldn't would I? I'm not a criminal trying to justify murdering civilians.
"We need to consider OBJECTIVES."
You can consider objectives, I am going to consider your fate.
"Are they just trying to compete for INTERNAL support among the Palestinians. Draw return fire so the population will side with them rather than with moderates who want some kind of settllement?"
Sounds a lot like trying to blame the victim for their own deaths. Standard routine in the politics of Hasbara. Heard it all before, nothing to see here, move along.
weak and feeble explanation that noone believes anymore
reality of idf
26.03.2011 15:00
I did my stint in the IDF between 1989 and 1992. We were often told to lie about what we were doing.
The problem is that the intelligence comes in, you have to act but more often than not, acting means you have to do things that are highly illegal internationally. For instance, if a missile comes in, the command then go through the intelligence to list up specific individuals to target in retaliation. Its all about retaliation. So a missile comes in, and a name is pulled out of the hat for shelling. If that targets kids die or his family are killed, that's the retaliation. It sends a message that they know what'll happen if they do it again.
Its a policy of an eye for an eye.
But since 2003, that policy has been enhanced, now the thinking is that you got to go further, now you have to exploit the situation so for every attack, a fixed number of targets has to be killed in retalition. That number is going up an up.
Someone else wrote about IDF going off duty and forming gangs to go out and dish up some extra duty punishment. That happened all the time, still goes on. The senior ranks are skilled at turning a blind eye to it. Nobody ever gets punished for it, not really. I was doing my service with a guy who cracked a women in the face with the but of his rifle at a checkpoint, she hadn't done anything, she just didn't move fast enough when he told her to move. He was supposed to go up for it but instead they jus moved him to a different unit. A lot of its to do with too much alcohol, you get pissed up and then go off in groups to dish it out to the arabs in private. Lot of alcohol abuse especially with the conscripts, lot of male on female abuse too. While I was in two of the girls were raped. One of them beaten badly. She had a fractured wrist and broken ribs. Guy who did it never got arrested, never got pulled either.
I fuckin hated my time in the Tzahal, crappest time of my life. I didn't learn anything, didn't do me any good as far as my career is concerned. All it did was teach me how to hate people.
From what I gather, things are much worse now, the things that are going on are sick. No control at the top, no discipline, its a mob outfit now.
JG
Bravo Two Zero
26.03.2011 15:21
I think we might be zeroing in on who he is. He is either fat with curly hair or he is in his late forties/early fifties, with white hair!
IMC
Pfff
26.03.2011 16:20
In the end, if the militants stopped firing rockets into Israel, then the international community might have more sympathy. But, at the moment, most people just thing Israel has a right to fight back and not sit there like a lemon whilst being attacked.
ed
Pfff
26.03.2011 16:20
In the end, if the militants stopped firing rockets into Israel, then the international community might have more sympathy. But, at the moment, most people just thing Israel has a right to fight back and not sit there like a lemon whilst being attacked.
ed
interesting about the idf
26.03.2011 16:49
My dad had a long career in the British army. He originally went in for national service but stayed on for a few years. He used to tell me that the Israeli's were all reputation and no substance. It was his generations job to talk them up all the time in order to overcome just how miserably inadequate they were in real life. He used to say they had a reputation for amateurism and fucking everything up. Most of the IDF at that time were mercenary and paid privately using weapons they bought privately. A real collection of extremists and misfits. Originally, they were more like Al Qaeda. They used to spend a lot of time on private missions getting into civilian areas and killing women and children while waging a secret war against the families of the men they couldn't find. The women and children were the toughest targets they could go up against without shitting themselves.
The modern day IDF is pretty much the same, except now funded by the Israeli government directly from funds received from sympathisers and money laundering operations in the UK and US. Some of the leaders and senior commanders in the IDF were originally mercenary's. They still use mercenary tactics. For every story you hear in the newspapers and TV or websites, there are a dozen secret deaths that happen in private. Usually of innocent women, children or farm hands.
Daniel
west is the best
26.03.2011 17:16
Nobody is buying the israeli line anymore, just like nobody is buying the al qaeda line anymore. There has been a sea change in attitudes toward this whole issue. People are more realistic about who the culprits really are and that change is evident in the jewish diaspora. The jewish population in israel is decreasing and the arab population increasing. Most young jews have been migrating out for better quality of life in the west. Once they arrive they don't return. Most jewish people are no longer religious and don't observe religious standards anymore.
One can only presume that its the israeli government that has, through its ineptitude, driven its own people out. Ultimately, people want peace and a life free of violence, the jews are no different. Modern immigrants who go to Israel find the quality of life poor and begin to look toward a better life elsewhere.
The Jewish diasporas needs can far better be met, and a much better quality of life can be had in the west. Jews living in the west are much wealthier and better off, than their counterparts in Israel.
Reality check
wrong
26.03.2011 17:23
Errr..... I think you will find that is complete bollox.
Israel has many international friends, a lot more than Palestine, Hamas or the militants have.
ed
Poor little dear
26.03.2011 18:17
Israel has many international friends, a lot more than Palestine, Hamas or the militants have."
Yes dear, that's nice.
Editor
getofied
26.03.2011 19:29
Excellent analysis :{
maybe they should put you in charge of everything
complete cunt