As Bliar Scandal Looms, Gov't Cries "Al Qaeda"
Al Qaeda = PNAC, CIA, Mossad, MI6 | 22.04.2007 22:17 | Repression | Terror War
As the legal ramifications of aspects of Bliar's Corruption come to bear, the Regime starts waving Emmanuel Goldstein - with the media's help - in the hopes of yet again distracting the populace.
Police poised to charge Blair's top adviser
Julia May in London
April 23, 2007
Other related coverage
Blair's aides to face charges in 'cash-for-honours' row: reports
Blair's aides facing charges in 'cash-for-honours' row
THE corruption scandal involving the British Prime Minister, Tony Blair, has intensified, with police poised to charge some of his advisers. And an embarrassing document has surfaced that reveals Mr Blair's strategy for wooing and "flattering" wealthy donors.
Scotland Yard detectives completed their 13-month "cash-for-peerages" inquiry and referred it to the Crown Prosecution Service on Friday. The Sunday Times reported that police were targeting Mr Blair's chief of staff, Jonathan Powell, over a secret meeting he allegedly held last year about "dealing with" the inquiry.
The paper claimed police were urging the prosecution service to charge Mr Powell with attempting to pervert the course of justice - a more serious crime than selling peerages or failing to disclose funding, both of which were investigated.
In another blow, The Sunday Telegraph published a damning Labour Party document that outlined the roles of the Prime Minister, his chief fund-raiser, Lord Levy, and Mr Blair's most senior advisers in luring donors by giving them access to senior Labour figures and "creating a reason to give". These included flattering donors' offers of policy advice and arranging private meetings with Mr Blair.
The cash-for-peerages investigation was sparked by allegations the Labour Party had sold nominations for the House of Lords for secret loans of £14 million.
Detectives expanded the investigation to include the other political parties. They interviewed 136 people - including Mr Blair - and arrested four people close to him: Lord Levy, Mr Blair's government relations adviser, Ruth Turner and a Labour backer, Sir Christopher Evans. The fourth person, Des Smith, a member of the Specialist Schools and Academies Trust, was interviewed but not charged. All have denied any wrongdoing.
The momentum for the case comes in what observers say are Mr Blair's final weeks in office. It is thought he will announce his resignation on May 9 or May 10, by which time the May 3 Scottish elections and a power-sharing agreement with Northern Ireland would be completed.
Angus MacNeil, the Scottish National Party MP who last year tipped off police about the cash-for-peerages deals, said it was unlikely there would be any charges before the Scottish election, but before Mr Blair steps down "would certainly be possible. It casts a massive cloud over Tony Blair's premiership".
The Scottish elections could also prove problematical for Mr Blair and his likely successor, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Gordon Brown. Polls indicate that the Scottish National Party may defeat Labour for the first time, and that the SNP's calls for independence are striking a chord among voters.
But Mr Brown has had a change of fortune after several torrid weeks in which his economic record was seriously undermined. A survey of Labour MPs by his supporters shows that he easily has the numbers to assume the leadership when Mr Blair departs.
This was further bolstered yesterday as a prospective leadership contender, Environment Secretary David Miliband, firmly ruled out a challenge by writing in The Observer that he would vote for Mr Brown.
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2007/04/22/1177180485855.html
Al-Qaeda‘planning big British attack’Dipesh Gadher
AL-QAEDA leaders in Iraq are planning the first “large-scale” terrorist attacks on Britain and other western targets with the help of supporters in Iran, according to a leaked intelligence report.
(Are these the same 'intelligence' operatives who told us Saddam's vast arsenal of WMD posed a dire threat to the world? There is no evidence that the group - which does not seem to exist outisde of Western/Israeli intelligence services - has ever operated in Iraq. The allegation that Iran, the next target of the Neo-Fascists, is in on the plot, makes me a tad sceptical ...)
Spy chiefs warn that one operative had said he was planning an attack on “a par with Hiroshima and Nagasaki” in an attempt to “shake the Roman throne”, a reference to the West.
("Spy chiefs"? Whom? This is interesting, given that it weas just announced that there would be drills to simulate a nuclear-terror strike. Remember, there were similar "drills" (Command Posts?) running on both 9/11 and 7/7.)
Another plot could be timed to coincide with Tony Blair stepping down as prime minister, an event described by Al-Qaeda planners as a “change in the head of the company”.
(That's pretty specific, westernized intel ...)
The report, produced earlier this month and seen by The Sunday Times, appears to provide evidence that Al-Qaeda is active in Iran and has ambitions far beyond the improvised attacks it has been waging against British and American soldiers in Iraq.
(In that case, these proven LIARS should put up or shut up.)
There is no evidence of a formal relationship between Al-Qaeda, a Sunni group, and the Shi’ite regime of President Mah-moud Ahmadinejad, but experts suggest that Iran’s leaders may be turning a blind eye to the terrorist organisation’s activities.
("Experts" ... ? Who writes this drivel? This is not responsible journalism.)
The intelligence report also makes it clear that senior Al-Qaeda figures in the region have been in recent contact with operatives in Britain.
(What report? Written by whom? What evidence? You have to first prove the group exists, and is active in Iraq. Thus far, the War Criminals making these unfounded accusations have balked when asked for their "evidence". This seems like an excuse to shrug off the fact that the troops are engaged with a legitimate Resistance Movement, fighting to Liberate its country from a Foreign Aggressor.)
It follows revelations last year that up to 150 Britons had travelled to Iraq to fight as part of Al-Qaeda’s “foreign legion”. A number are thought to have returned to the UK, after receiving terrorist training, to form sleeper cells.
(That's a lot of intelligence for people who claim to be incapable of tracking these people ...)
The report was compiled by the Joint Terrorism Analysis Centre (JTAC) - based at MI5’s London headquarters - and provides a quarterly review of the international terror threat to Britain. It draws a distinction between Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda’s core leadership, who are thought to be hiding on the Afghan-Pakistan border, and affiliated organisations elsewhere.
(Alright, so this isn't exactly a crediblke group, nor report. Thanks for saving that for the end of the highly speculative article! Shamless ...)
The document states: “While networks linked to AQ [Al-Qaeda] Core pose the greatest threat to the UK, the intelligence during this quarter has highlighted the potential threat from other areas, particularly AQI [Al-Qaeda in Iraq].”
The report continues: “Recent reporting has described AQI’s Kurdish network in Iran planning what we believe may be a large-scale attack against a western target.
(Riiiiight ...)
“A member of this network is reportedly involved in an operation which he believes requires AQ Core authorisation. He claims the operation will be on ‘a par with Hiroshima and Naga-saki’ and will ‘shake the Roman throne’. We assess that this operation is most likely to be a large-scale, mass casualty attack against the West.”
(Then with all the intelligence they have, the Government should have no problem in stopping such a thing from happening ... Incompetence or Complicity? What will their excuse be this time?)
The report says there is “no indication” this attack would specifically target Britain, “although we are aware that AQI . . . networks are active in the UK”.
Analysts believe the reference to Hiroshima and Naga-saki, where more than 200,000 people died in nuclear attacks on Japan at the end of the second world war, is unlikely to be a literal boast.
“It could be just a reference to a huge explosion,” said a counter-terrorist source. “They [Al-Qaeda] have got to do something soon that is radical otherwise they start losing credibility.”
(Kinda like their opponents ...)
Despite aspiring to a nuclear capability, Al-Qaeda is not thought to have acquired weapons grade material. However, several plots involving “dirty bombs” - conventional explosive devices surrounded by radioactive material - have been foiled.
(Buuuuull Sh****T)
Last year Al-Qaeda’s leader in Iraq called on nuclear scientists to apply their knowledge of biological and radiological weapons to “the field of jihad”.
Details of a separate plot to attack Britain, “ideally” before Blair steps down this summer, were contained in a letter written by Abdul al-Hadi al-Iraqi, an Iraqi Kurd and senior Al-Qaeda commander.
According to the JTAC document, Hadi “stressed the need to take care to ensure that the attack was successful and on a large scale”. The plan was to be relayed to an Iran-based Al-Qaeda facilitator.
The Home Office declined to comment.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1687360.ece
Julia May in London
April 23, 2007
Other related coverage
Blair's aides to face charges in 'cash-for-honours' row: reports
Blair's aides facing charges in 'cash-for-honours' row
THE corruption scandal involving the British Prime Minister, Tony Blair, has intensified, with police poised to charge some of his advisers. And an embarrassing document has surfaced that reveals Mr Blair's strategy for wooing and "flattering" wealthy donors.
Scotland Yard detectives completed their 13-month "cash-for-peerages" inquiry and referred it to the Crown Prosecution Service on Friday. The Sunday Times reported that police were targeting Mr Blair's chief of staff, Jonathan Powell, over a secret meeting he allegedly held last year about "dealing with" the inquiry.
The paper claimed police were urging the prosecution service to charge Mr Powell with attempting to pervert the course of justice - a more serious crime than selling peerages or failing to disclose funding, both of which were investigated.
In another blow, The Sunday Telegraph published a damning Labour Party document that outlined the roles of the Prime Minister, his chief fund-raiser, Lord Levy, and Mr Blair's most senior advisers in luring donors by giving them access to senior Labour figures and "creating a reason to give". These included flattering donors' offers of policy advice and arranging private meetings with Mr Blair.
The cash-for-peerages investigation was sparked by allegations the Labour Party had sold nominations for the House of Lords for secret loans of £14 million.
Detectives expanded the investigation to include the other political parties. They interviewed 136 people - including Mr Blair - and arrested four people close to him: Lord Levy, Mr Blair's government relations adviser, Ruth Turner and a Labour backer, Sir Christopher Evans. The fourth person, Des Smith, a member of the Specialist Schools and Academies Trust, was interviewed but not charged. All have denied any wrongdoing.
The momentum for the case comes in what observers say are Mr Blair's final weeks in office. It is thought he will announce his resignation on May 9 or May 10, by which time the May 3 Scottish elections and a power-sharing agreement with Northern Ireland would be completed.
Angus MacNeil, the Scottish National Party MP who last year tipped off police about the cash-for-peerages deals, said it was unlikely there would be any charges before the Scottish election, but before Mr Blair steps down "would certainly be possible. It casts a massive cloud over Tony Blair's premiership".
The Scottish elections could also prove problematical for Mr Blair and his likely successor, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Gordon Brown. Polls indicate that the Scottish National Party may defeat Labour for the first time, and that the SNP's calls for independence are striking a chord among voters.
But Mr Brown has had a change of fortune after several torrid weeks in which his economic record was seriously undermined. A survey of Labour MPs by his supporters shows that he easily has the numbers to assume the leadership when Mr Blair departs.
This was further bolstered yesterday as a prospective leadership contender, Environment Secretary David Miliband, firmly ruled out a challenge by writing in The Observer that he would vote for Mr Brown.
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2007/04/22/1177180485855.html
Al-Qaeda‘planning big British attack’Dipesh Gadher
AL-QAEDA leaders in Iraq are planning the first “large-scale” terrorist attacks on Britain and other western targets with the help of supporters in Iran, according to a leaked intelligence report.
(Are these the same 'intelligence' operatives who told us Saddam's vast arsenal of WMD posed a dire threat to the world? There is no evidence that the group - which does not seem to exist outisde of Western/Israeli intelligence services - has ever operated in Iraq. The allegation that Iran, the next target of the Neo-Fascists, is in on the plot, makes me a tad sceptical ...)
Spy chiefs warn that one operative had said he was planning an attack on “a par with Hiroshima and Nagasaki” in an attempt to “shake the Roman throne”, a reference to the West.
("Spy chiefs"? Whom? This is interesting, given that it weas just announced that there would be drills to simulate a nuclear-terror strike. Remember, there were similar "drills" (Command Posts?) running on both 9/11 and 7/7.)
Another plot could be timed to coincide with Tony Blair stepping down as prime minister, an event described by Al-Qaeda planners as a “change in the head of the company”.
(That's pretty specific, westernized intel ...)
The report, produced earlier this month and seen by The Sunday Times, appears to provide evidence that Al-Qaeda is active in Iran and has ambitions far beyond the improvised attacks it has been waging against British and American soldiers in Iraq.
(In that case, these proven LIARS should put up or shut up.)
There is no evidence of a formal relationship between Al-Qaeda, a Sunni group, and the Shi’ite regime of President Mah-moud Ahmadinejad, but experts suggest that Iran’s leaders may be turning a blind eye to the terrorist organisation’s activities.
("Experts" ... ? Who writes this drivel? This is not responsible journalism.)
The intelligence report also makes it clear that senior Al-Qaeda figures in the region have been in recent contact with operatives in Britain.
(What report? Written by whom? What evidence? You have to first prove the group exists, and is active in Iraq. Thus far, the War Criminals making these unfounded accusations have balked when asked for their "evidence". This seems like an excuse to shrug off the fact that the troops are engaged with a legitimate Resistance Movement, fighting to Liberate its country from a Foreign Aggressor.)
It follows revelations last year that up to 150 Britons had travelled to Iraq to fight as part of Al-Qaeda’s “foreign legion”. A number are thought to have returned to the UK, after receiving terrorist training, to form sleeper cells.
(That's a lot of intelligence for people who claim to be incapable of tracking these people ...)
The report was compiled by the Joint Terrorism Analysis Centre (JTAC) - based at MI5’s London headquarters - and provides a quarterly review of the international terror threat to Britain. It draws a distinction between Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda’s core leadership, who are thought to be hiding on the Afghan-Pakistan border, and affiliated organisations elsewhere.
(Alright, so this isn't exactly a crediblke group, nor report. Thanks for saving that for the end of the highly speculative article! Shamless ...)
The document states: “While networks linked to AQ [Al-Qaeda] Core pose the greatest threat to the UK, the intelligence during this quarter has highlighted the potential threat from other areas, particularly AQI [Al-Qaeda in Iraq].”
The report continues: “Recent reporting has described AQI’s Kurdish network in Iran planning what we believe may be a large-scale attack against a western target.
(Riiiiight ...)
“A member of this network is reportedly involved in an operation which he believes requires AQ Core authorisation. He claims the operation will be on ‘a par with Hiroshima and Naga-saki’ and will ‘shake the Roman throne’. We assess that this operation is most likely to be a large-scale, mass casualty attack against the West.”
(Then with all the intelligence they have, the Government should have no problem in stopping such a thing from happening ... Incompetence or Complicity? What will their excuse be this time?)
The report says there is “no indication” this attack would specifically target Britain, “although we are aware that AQI . . . networks are active in the UK”.
Analysts believe the reference to Hiroshima and Naga-saki, where more than 200,000 people died in nuclear attacks on Japan at the end of the second world war, is unlikely to be a literal boast.
“It could be just a reference to a huge explosion,” said a counter-terrorist source. “They [Al-Qaeda] have got to do something soon that is radical otherwise they start losing credibility.”
(Kinda like their opponents ...)
Despite aspiring to a nuclear capability, Al-Qaeda is not thought to have acquired weapons grade material. However, several plots involving “dirty bombs” - conventional explosive devices surrounded by radioactive material - have been foiled.
(Buuuuull Sh****T)
Last year Al-Qaeda’s leader in Iraq called on nuclear scientists to apply their knowledge of biological and radiological weapons to “the field of jihad”.
Details of a separate plot to attack Britain, “ideally” before Blair steps down this summer, were contained in a letter written by Abdul al-Hadi al-Iraqi, an Iraqi Kurd and senior Al-Qaeda commander.
According to the JTAC document, Hadi “stressed the need to take care to ensure that the attack was successful and on a large scale”. The plan was to be relayed to an Iran-based Al-Qaeda facilitator.
The Home Office declined to comment.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1687360.ece
Al Qaeda = PNAC, CIA, Mossad, MI6
Comments
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Comments on the Times article
22.04.2007 23:26
See also: Four days of “simulated” nuclear terrorist scenarios in the US & Europe https://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/04/368361.html
This is a VERY concerning report, especially for anyone who has scientifically evaluated all the evidence concerning the attacks of 9/11 and 7/7.
It appears that we are being prepared by MI5/MI6 and the British government for a massive False Flag terrorist attack bigger than 9/11. This will be an attack that will be totally provocateured by the Anglo-American military industrial complex. There is no depth that the intelligence operatives of the military industrial complex will stoop, in terms of murdering their fellow citizens, and the order of death will be in the hundreds of thousands.
Other than that the only real reason for this report would be to continue the fear-mongering and the beating of the jingoistic war drums, to pre-program the population for the coming war in Iran.
Disgusting, filthy, propaganda and lies from MI5/MI6.
Steve Holmes, Southampton, England, UK
Generally, when a "report" is leaked, it is leaked for a reason. The comparison to Hiroshima and Nagasaki seems tailor-made to create the specter of a dangerously nuclear Iran in people's minds. In other words, this is part of a pre-invasion publicity campaign against Iran.
EKSwitaj, Zhengzhou, China
I read this story after reading and listening to this last night.
Noble Resolve 07: Four days of “simulated” nuclear terrorist scenarios in the US & Europe ....
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/april2007/190407resolve.htm
On September 11th, 2001, drills that simulated a hijacked aircraft attack on the US were underway when hijacked aircraft were used to attack America. In London, on July 7th, 2005, there was a drill simulating multiple bombings on the underground railway that was eerily interrupted by multiple bombings on the underground railway.
So, I can understand why these drills for a nuclear terror attack have some people worried.
Jim Miller, Grand Rapids, MI
I have to agree with Sam on this one. This sounds like unsubstantiated claims (based on propaganda and alarmist fiction), which is aimed at making it easier for Britain to go along with any US attacks on Iran. The Iranian regime (which is far from perfect), does not have any ties to Al Quaeda (a Sunni group, funded by the US, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan). George Bush tried to link Osama Bin Laden to Sadaam Hussein, in order to enrage the American people and make war more acceptable. We have to be more aware of what the different political agendas are trying to achieve in the Middle East. A full blown conflict with Iran would spread far beyond the region, and make the current disaster in Iraq pale in comparison.
Andy, Rochester, England
One lesson from the marketing campaign leading up to the Iraq War is that articles containing unnamed sources cannot be trusted. This story didn't contain a single named source. Then, those sources told us that Iraq was on the verge of a nuke, had drones ready to spray chemical weapons on the West, was involved in the anthrax attacks in the US, and was working closely with al Qaeda. Now, they tell us that Iran is turning a blind eye to al Qaeda's preparations for a huge attack. To quote GWB, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, won't get fooled again."
Do you really think that Iranians think they would benefit from another terrorist attack in the West, particularly one that involved preparations in Iran?
This is likely part of the campaign to prepare public opinion for attacks on Iran. We've already heard about Iran's nukes, IEDs made in Iran, weapons from Iran, and Iran's bogeyman Ahmadinejad.
telegram sam, London, UK
repost
Homepage: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1687360.ece
O God not again
23.04.2007 07:48
Why does Indymedia UK give this facist a platform ?
Jordan Thornton = anti semitism/race hatred/ stupidity
Organised campaign of harrassment?
23.04.2007 08:31
In light of this, comments attacking Nimmo and Thornton without evidence to back up the claims made against them will be hidden without further notice, under the 'inaccurate' guideline.
www..indymedia.org.uk/en/static/editorial.html
Indymedia uk: A network of individuals, independent and alternative media activists and organisations, offering grassroots, non-corporate, non-commercial coverage of important social and political issues.
imcista
You must be kidding
23.04.2007 08:41
What by pointing out Thornton's anti-semitism and Kurt Nimmo's paranoia with all things CIA ?
Still its nice to know that the Indymedia moderators have now moved to a position that certain individuals are beyond critical comment !
It's no wonder Indymedia has been so discreditied in the Anarchist and UK Left when it does stuff like this.
Open to critical comment (unlike friends of IM Editors)
Beyond critical comment?
23.04.2007 08:55
Erm, I've put the relevant bit in capital letters to help you to understand what is being said:
"In light of this, comments attacking Nimmo and Thornton WITHOUT EVIDENCE TO BACK UP THE CLAIMS MADE AGAINST THEM will be hidden without further notice, under the 'inaccurate' guideline."
I see zero evidence in your post!
imcista
Not the right decision
23.04.2007 09:16
I would question if this decision has been reached by any process of consultation with others.
Alan
e-mail: Alan_Woodworking@GMail.com
Straight from the horse's mouth
23.04.2007 09:27
"If not so pathetic, it would be comical. A certain Israeli settler is heartened by David Irving’s conviction for so-called “Holocaust Denial,” in fact Irving was convicted for not buying the official, Zionist approved version of the Second World War [...]"
http://kurtnimmo.com/?p=241
"Now that the “Notorious Holocaust Denier,” as the New York Times characterized David Irving, has pleaded guilty and faces three years in an Austrian prison for the crime of deviating from the official, Zionist-sanctioned and imposed history of the Second World War, we can expect triumphant ballyhoos from the Zionists, a screaming and obnoxious declaration of victory for the small outlaw nation of Israel and its endless blackmailing of millions of people who had nothing to do with Auschwitz and its discredited gas chambers."
http://kurtnimmo.com/?p=236
In case the point has escaped you. This guy isn't defending Irving's right to free speech, he's actually ENDORSING his "revisionist" theses.
In case, it has also escaped your attention, Austria isn't being run by ZOG as pretty much implied. I suppose Joerg Hayder was a Mossad plant?
Do I get an apology, and an unhide?
Mr Ed
banned from a number of Indymedias?
23.04.2007 09:33
Thats quite a claim. Which sites would they be? And what are the "questionable views on Jews" to which you refer?
See what is meant by 'unsubstantiated claims'?
"it is somewhat surprising to see what I take to be an Indymedia UK moderator declare him to be some sort of special case."
Well, he's one of two people whose posts seem to attract lots of attacks containing unsubstantiated claims - and there is nothing special about requesting that anonymous attacks on posters should at least have some evidence that they are not just inventions to prevent a pov from being heard.
"I would question if this decision has been reached by any process of consultation with others."
I believe that guidelines were indeed reached by a process of consultation with others. They didn't appear from nowhere.
imcista
Wrong - Wrong - Wrong - Wrong
23.04.2007 09:33
My God what has this site become
Kermit
Really ?
23.04.2007 09:44
so an anonymous IMC moderator makes a unilateral decision to provide editorial protection to two individuals without consultation to any of the public lists. He/ She then hides comments which are critical of this. Not really what you would call "open publishing" is it ?
Seriously IMC, this is a step too far. I don't agree with all the comments of Thornton and Nimmo but there are parts of their blogs which do make me feel uncomfortable and their views do deserve to be challenged when they are wrong.
Providing them with some sort of special status is not the way forward. We discussed doing something similar for Latuff at one of the IMC meetings about a year ago and decided against it. This decision vis a vis Nimmo and Thornton was a mistake.
Not Anonymous just careful
e-mail: AllTheKingsMen@riseup.net
Lets say it happend
23.04.2007 10:02
Dismissed
Answers
23.04.2007 10:06
Jordan Thornton is banned from the following Indymedia sites
Winipeg
London Ontario
SF- Indymedia
British Columbia
Vancouver
to name but five....
His views on Jews and the Holocaust can be seen here
www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/719130.html
happy to help
"I see Jews/Israel/Mossad everywhere... "
23.04.2007 10:37
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nafeez_Mosaddeq_Ahmed
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/026-5522011-2387625?%5Fencoding=UTF8&search-type=ss&index=books-uk&field-author=Nafeez%20Mosaddeq%20Ahmed
His book on 7/7 is shocking reading. His style is dry and & academic much like Chomsky, and similarly all the more chilling for it.
He posits the most likely scenario being that Al Qaeda do exist, but there is a twisted and insane history of Al Qaeda & Western governments collaborating/cohabitation where it suits them both.
The Finsbury Park Mosque faction seem to have been brought to the UK by HM Gvt. (Downing Street, FO, MI5/6) to recruit mujahadin for the the Balkan & Central Asian energy resource grab. The training camps we keep hearing of had a level of UK Gvt. assistance.
I wonder also to what degree the "incitement to racial hatred" law was enacted to nail Hamza without the embarrassment of a trial that would reveal his MI5/6 involvement. But, I would be getting ahead of myself with that one.
They were here under the understanding that they could do whatever they pleased so long as they they didn't stage any attacks on the locals. In fact, they were pretty much protected by the Establishment.
It backfired. The way that 7/7 and 9/11 have been handled begs more the question if innocent civilians are now being viewed as affordable collateral damage in the West's war on anyone who stands in the way of their fossil fuel power structure.
There is ample documentation out there to support this thesis. Read the book, it's all referenced to sources in the mainstream.
There is also ample blank spaces explaining how the US/UK have handled the Al Qaeda guests they had in their countries to beg for a public and comprehensive inquiry, but frankly all this Mossad, False Flag stuff is just the new hulahoop for people who want to reinforce their (often mad &/ racist) prejudices rather than anything approaching real research.
Good research starts with data and derives an explicit interpretation with testable tools. Bad research starts with a thesis and like Procrustes lops and stretches the data to fit.
This total crap about the Jews ruling the world and Al Qaeda being a CIA/MI5/Mossad Black Op is just Scooby Doo on bad acid and oversimplified to the point of being a "flat earth theory".
As usual, reality is far, far weirder, scary and baffling than fantasy. However, as usual, people with dubious politics will try and pin it all Israel/Jews/ZOG (albeit using the neo-crypto-anti-semtic lexis). and you have got to wonder on the politics/motivation of anyone who fixates on Israel/Jews as being the lowest common denominator for everything bad that happens in the world. Especially when they regularly repost articles from people with dubious credentials.
I don't like promoting people's books, but go read the book, you can get a second hand copy on Amazon cheap.
Mr Ed
"Happy to help"
23.04.2007 11:15
Are they notified on the websites or on the mailing lists?
The Haaretz link returns a 404, as does a google of "Jordan Thornton" and Haaretz.
Archive.org shows a rather different article to the one you suggest:
"Let them fight it out
By Edward N. Luttwak
Civil wars can be especially atrocious as neighbors kill each other at close range, but they, too, have a purpose in this world - they can bring lasting peace by destroying the will to fight, and by removing the motives and opportunities for further violence.
England's civil war in the mid-17th century assured subsequent centuries of political stability under parliament and a limited monarchy. But first there had to be a war with several pitched battles and some killings on the side, including the decapitation of King Charles I, who had claimed absolute power by divine right."
is how it starts
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/719130.html
imcista
"straight from the horses mouth"
23.04.2007 11:40
I've quoted a refutation of the claim of holocaust denial from the same horse.
At best you've interpreted his words about Irving and come up with an interpretation, which Nimmo does deny. I can't see how it justifies continual posts claiming that interpretation as fact.
The apparent smear campaign, which includes a number of posters, seems to work on the basis that if its said often enough, the mud will stick.
If Nimmo is a holocaust denier, then surely there must be better evidence of it than the interpretation of his words presented by you?
imcista
Happy to help
23.04.2007 12:00
"Thank you - how can I check your claims of these bans?"
from the person claiming to be from the IMC team may I suggest e-mail. It's quite a good form of communication these days.
Of course we know you're not going to do that are you, instead you will continue to post questions, pretend links are broken and post spurious crap about the English Civil War aren't you ? The support for anti-semites on IMC UK never ceases to upset me.
Not so happy now...
Shame on you
23.04.2007 12:08
IF ! Are you seriously suggesting he isn't ?
This demand for proof is a smokescreen and you know it.
Whoever is hiding behind the IMCSTER handle should hang their head in shame
Ashamed of Indymedia
Double standard
23.04.2007 12:11
MMM
Proof?
23.04.2007 12:24
""If Nimmo is a holocaust denier..."
IF ! Are you seriously suggesting he isn't ?"
I have yet to see proof that he is. Now what was the bit you didn't quote?
Aah yes "..... then surely there must be better evidence of it than the interpretation of his words presented by you?"
Well, where is it?
'Not so happy now...' wrote:
" I suggest e-mail. It's quite a good form of communication these days."
Indeed - it is. However, as you're the one claiming that he is banned on 5 sites, you must have got the information from somewhere, so why should I waste the time of 5 collectives when you must have the proof?
'Not so happy now...' also wrote:
", instead you will continue to post questions, pretend links are broken and post spurious crap about the English Civil War aren't you ?"
Tell you what - why not post the link to the article on Haaretz where "His views on Jews and the Holocaust can be seen" so that anyone reading this list can click on it and read it for themselves?
You might have got the point by now - just because you say it doesn't make it true - you have to back it up.
I'm off to do better things with my time.
imcista
Not a smear campaign
23.04.2007 12:33
The imcster talks about a "smear campaign". I don't regard showing how an individual is a Holocaust denier a "smear" I regard it as education.
Grant Thornton spams Indymedia sites all over the world with his rubbish and some have already restricted his access or in rare cases actualy banned him (Canada where he lives). There is no place for him here and there should certainly be no special protection for him from those who expose his lies whenever he posts.
I don't know who is now controlling Indymedia UK Newswire but I'll admit to being very worried by the recent direction it has been taking when it comes to issues over Jews and Israel.
GK
GK
"I'm off to do better things with my time. "
23.04.2007 12:39
you anti semitic fucker
I do not support this new policy
23.04.2007 12:44
Alice
Jordan Thorton and Roy Bard.
23.04.2007 12:50
Secret Zionist Mossad operative
imcista
23.04.2007 12:51
"If not so pathetic, it would be comical. A certain Israeli settler is heartened by David Irving’s conviction for so-called “Holocaust Denial,” in fact Irving was convicted for not buying the official, Zionist approved version of the Second World War [...]"
http://kurtnimmo.com/?p=241
"Now that the “Notorious Holocaust Denier,” as the New York Times characterized David Irving, has pleaded guilty and faces three years in an Austrian prison for the crime of deviating from the official, Zionist-sanctioned and imposed history of the Second World War, we can expect triumphant ballyhoos from the Zionists, a screaming and obnoxious declaration of victory for the small outlaw nation of Israel and its endless blackmailing of millions of people who had nothing to do with Auschwitz and its discredited gas chambers."
http://kurtnimmo.com/?p=236
Now I can only assume you haven't done much reading on Holocaust Denial/Revisionism not be able to spot this?
David Irving was a major player in the denial movement. It's been about a decade since I was researching the area. But basically, as I recall, Irving's claim was that there were no gas chambers at Auschwitz and thereby the holocaust could not have happened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Irving#Accusations_of_Holocaust_denial
Anyone who remotely read on Denial will be able to spot Nimmo endorsing this thesis:
"the small outlaw nation of Israel and its endless blackmailing of millions of people who had nothing to do with Auschwitz and its DISCREDITED GAS CHAMBERS." My emphasis.
The quotation marks around "holocaust denier" in reference to Irving is also an obvious endorsement. The charge of denier levelled at Irving is not remotely controversial, unless you belong to Aryan Nations or the BNP.
And all this from the man Nimmo's own mouth, not some hearsay!
How much more proof do you need? A sworn affidavit and a DNA sample?
Shall we move onto Jeff Rense's love affair with the ideas of denier & neo-nazi Ernst Zuendl and the shady connections of the American Free Press & Counterpunch- other popular repositories for the new crypto-anti-semites?
Mr Ed
Sigh....
23.04.2007 12:59
Anti Semitism, irrelevant in a generation
sieg
23.04.2007 13:08
:{
"I'm off to do better things with my time. "
23.04.2007 13:10
Alice
Jordon Thornton
23.04.2007 13:16
Al Qaeda = PNAC, CIA, Mossad, MI6 or
"Zionism, Irrelevant in a Generation"
has been banned from a number of Indymedia newswires because of his disgusting views. Why we here in the UK should give him support and protect him from critisism I can't imagine. As far as I'm aware this was never decided by discussion on the lists so must assume it was one persons decision.
Fight Facism in all its forms
Wow!
23.04.2007 13:31
David Duke
Homepage: http://www.adl.org/special_reports/duke_own_words/duke_intro.asp
Joke ?
23.04.2007 13:48
Is this special protection for these people supposed to be some sort of joke ? A late April fool ?
Coco the clown
False posts
23.04.2007 14:06
It's no wonder this decision has generated so much traffic today, I can only presume the person calling him or herself 'imcster' is not really anything to do with the main collective that runs the admin of the site but rather some sort of trouble maker out to create problems. Perhaps a statement from one of the real admins could confirm this ?
Thanks to all the admins
Gaz from Durham
quick, quick hide the truth before anybody reads it
23.04.2007 14:22
LOL !
running away is not the answer
quick, quick hide the truth before anybody reads it
23.04.2007 14:27
LOL !
running away is not the answer
Well
23.04.2007 14:50
Mr Ed
Believe nothing you hear repeated and only half of what you see for yourself
23.04.2007 15:04
Why doesn’t ‘Holocaust Denial’ include the repeated exclusion of the murder of 9 million trade unionists, gypsies, Slavs, Blacks, Gays, and disabled people…or indeed other holocausts!
How should we react when we here an old Jewish woman says she doesn’t understand how Jews could ever forgive the ‘gentiles’ for what they done to the Jews. What about all the gentiles who died fighting the Nazis? Isn’t that denial offensive?
At the end of the day why should we believe the official account of anything? History is written by the victors, and is invariably subjective!
And does questioning the official account really qualify as holocaust ‘Denial’ if you believe that a holocaust did actually occur, albeit slightly differently to the actual official account.
Is there any another example where it is illegal to question the official account of an event? Will there be a law to protect the official account of 911, or the ‘War on Terror’ I wonder?
And before anyone says I am a fascist, I am most definitely not, I just hate being told what to regard as true or false, especially when that order comes from an inherently corrupt state.
to the 32 hidden comments
A very bad day for Indymedia
23.04.2007 15:17
1 comment saying its ok to question the Holocaust deemed acceptable.
The reputation of the UK newswire has been badly damaged here today, I have received about 20 emails from various friends all commenting on this thread ranging from surprise to anger. I never thought I would see the day when Indymedia UK finaly crossed the line but that is exactly what has happened here.
I write this with tears in my eyes
Simone
Simone
23.04.2007 15:52
Take heart, they won't be allowed to get away with it.
Andy
First thoughts on this
23.04.2007 16:03
MI6 is now claiming that shiah Iran is cooperating with Sunni terrorists - this is patently absurd, much dafter than their provenly false previous claim that Saddam was cooperating with Al Qaeda. MI6 are simultaneously claiming Sunni 'freedom fighters' are 'creating unrest' in south west Iran. so what is it MI6 - are al Qaeda working with Iran or is it British forces destablising south west Iran ? Cos you can't have it both ways
Dirty bombs are not effective WMD. They would kill very few people if sensible saftey precautions were taken - staying in doors, keeping windows shut etc. They are an effective way to inspire terror though. A dirty bomb would be an effective false flag operation as few would die and great panic would ensue. Each British DU shell fired in Iraq is a 'dirty bomb' and the fallout from that has already reached the UK. so it is perfectly concievable that the security services could justify this to themselves. If such a flase flag opertion was to take place, and given this initial propaganda, I would suggest it is more likely to be targetted at the Vatican. What better way to stir up the next religious crusade than to attack 'the Roman throne' ? That is just speculation of course.
What isn't speculation is that there has been a campaign against Kurt and Jordan on IM. I was part of that a year ago, and it was only when I found that the person who had led me to that was a MI agent that I was forced to rethink my position and apologise. If these people aren't onto something then why are they being smeared by active agents ?
Danny
US Trains "al CIAeda" Terrorists For Use In Lebanon
24.04.2007 01:36
The Phony (Mossad) Al Qaeda Cell in Palestine
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda.html
US training Sunni extremists to attack Hizbullah; operations to be attributed to Al-Qaeda
Thursday, April 19, 2007
(with an added note)
Issam Naaman is a Lebanese lawyer and writer, former Minister of Telecommunications under one of the governments led by Salim al-Hoss, and a member of a small political group that considers itself a third alternative beween the Hariri-led establishment, and the Hizbullah-led opposition. He wrote on April 18 in Al-Quds al-Arabi about information gleaned from the recent Pelosi delegation, and other US delegations at about the same time, mostly by a friend of his who is a think-tank type and didn't want his name used.
His main points were that Bush seems to be stymied in his desire to attack Iran, both by the political opposition of the Democrats, and the popular revulsion in the US against further military adventures that would be seen as at the expense of things like health insurance and the US standard of living. (By contrast, Bush policy on Palestine will be unchanged, because in the case of Palestine there is no pressure for change from Congress, in fact the Democrats outdo the Republicans in their support for Israel). As a "substitute" for not being able to strike Iran, the Bush administration plans an escalation in Lebanon. And here he mentions two specific points: (1) Tom Lantos said they are convinced Hizbullah is weak and this is the time to step up efforts to disarm it. (2) An airport in northern Lebanon will be used as a base for pressuring Syria, and also as a place for training of groups opposed to Hizbullah and opposed to anti-Abbas elements in Palestine. Then there was this:
It was learned from influential members of the US delegations that the Washington special[-forces] apparatus has begun assembling, arming and training members of Islamic extremist groups to undertake assaults on Hizbullah, in the framework of the conflict that it [the Bush administration] plans between the Sunni and the Shiite population, in districts where the two groups are contiguous. And it will be arranged to camouflage the agents in this by attributing the attacks to AlQaeda.
The writer's conclusion is that these exchanges with the American visitors confirmed that the Bush administration will not allow there to be any compromise in the dispute between the Hizbullah-led opposition and the Hariri administration over power-sharing, new elections and so on. Rather, the US administration will be working hard to promote confrontation, as part of its region-wide policy of fostering Sunni-Shiite conflict. In this context, the writer doesn't seem to regard the covert sponsorship of fake-AlQaeda US agents to be anything but one more ingredient in the overall plan.
This planned use by the Bush administration of Sunni extremists to stir the pot in Lebanon was discussed at length by New Yorker article called "The Redirection" last month, eliciting only an eerie silence from the policy elite. Judging from this Naaman piece, it would appear the scheme is pretty much a bipartisan open secret, which raises the question why no criticism from the Democrats. Or maybe answers the question.
mparent7777.blogspot.com/2007/04/us-training-sunni-extremists-to-attack.
Al Qaeda + PNAC, CIA, Mossad, MI6
ZOG & Holocaust denial
24.04.2007 08:06
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/holocaust.html
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/briefing.html
And the money shot:
http://www.cafepress.com/wrh_store
Pro-Palsetine
Danny ...
25.04.2007 04:00
Jordan
e-mail: pilgrim112@hotmail.com
Leaking Secrets
02.05.2007 11:59
Interestingly the Financial Times decided to publish only a tiny fraction of this information, which was explosive back then in October 2003, as extraordinary rendition had not yet hit the headlines. But the leak was enough to get me sacked, and to institute a formal leak inquiry. Once it became plain that I was not the leaker, the inquiry was quietly stopped.
I have therefore been more sensitive than most to the Government's continued habit of leaking "Intelligence" when it suits it. My objection has largely been that the government does this in order to exaggerate the threat of terrorism and instil fear, which they view as helpful in rallying popular support to the "War on Terror".
I was therefore furious when I saw a headline "Al-Qaeda planning Big British Attack" in the Sunday Times of 22 April. So furious I have been carrying the cutting in my pocket all the way to Moscow, until I got the chance to blog about it. I see in the interim the opposition have started making a related point.
The Sunday Times journalist, Dipesh Gadher, claims to have seen a Joint Terrorism Analysis Centre (JTAC) report which justifies the terror stirring headline.
But JTAC reports are almost always Top Secret, and are always classified. Unless Gadher made it all up, he and whoever showed it to him, and his Editor, are all guilty of a serious criminal offence. They should be jailed for many years under the Official Secrets Act.
This is especially true as two gentlemen are currently being tried under precisely that draconian legislation, for possessing the minute of the meeting where George Bush proposed to Tony Blair the bombing of Al-Jazeera TV.
The truth is that both the police and the Crown Prosecution Service act in these matters in a way that is blatantly political. There is no even-handed administration of justice here. If a pro-war antagonist leaks information to whip up public opinion, no action is ever taken. Let me be plain - there is nothing in law that says that secret material can be leaked if it supports the government. Yet they do it all the time.
By what right was David Shayler jailed, but Dipesh Gadher and his informant not even looked at?
Government members and supporters do what they like. But should anyone else follow suit, the full wrath of the Establishment crashes on their head. Even, as in my case, when they didn't actually do it.
The administration of justice is not impartial in the UK.
Craig Murray
Homepage: http://www.craigmurray.co.uk/archives/2007/04/leaking_secrets.html
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