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Exposing the 9/11 Conspiracy Wingnuts

Bill Douglas, author of "The Amateur Parent - A Book on Life, Death, War & Peace | 12.07.2006 20:17 | Analysis

An expose of the 9/11 conspiracy wing nuts endangering the very core of our democracy, and world peace.

I began researching the mainstream media coverage of the controversy regarding the attacks of 9/11/2001, when reading an article in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel Newspaper, dated June 29th, 2006. It was titled, "Sept. 11 claim stirs UW probe -- Instructor says U.S. planned the attacks to provoke war." This led to my discovery of some wild conspiracy theorists that endanger our government and media establishments, with quite frankly insane assertions. I'll address this in full in the final paragraph.

Then by using a "google video 9/11" search, I recently viewed a FOX News interview on Hannity and Colmes with an Arab Studies teacher from the University of Wisconsin named Kevin Barrett. I had earlier seen an interview with another, a professor named James Fetzer, University of Minnesota Duluth. A few weeks earlier I had seen an interview on MSNBC Scarborough country interviewing a Mike Berger representing 911Truth.org.

Some of these guests referred to an organization called "Scholars for 9/11 Truth" with a website www.st911.org, which offered a physics research paper questioning the official explanation of the events of 9/11/2001. While visiting this site, I read that they pointed to the temperatures of the fires in the WTC buildings, and construction of the buildings, and the speed they fell, as evidence they claimed proved that what we saw on 9/11/2001 when the towers fell had to have been the result of a controlled demolition. Like the ones we've seen with Las Vegas hotels being brought down. Their claim was that the WTC buildings could not have been caused solely by the aircraft hitting the WTC buildings that day.

Then, I contacted the office of a Wisconsin State Legislator, Rep. Stephen Nass (R-Whitewater), and asked to speak to someone in the office who could speak on this issue. I asked if he was familiar with the Scholars for 9/11 Truth website, and he replied they had learned of it this week. I asked him if he and the Representative could comment on the charge that the fires on 9/11/2001 in the WTC buildings did not burn hot enough to bring down the buildings, and if he'd read the scholars organization's charge that thermate traces had been found on debris from the fallen towers (thermate indicating demolition type explosives were involved). The gentleman responded that no, they had not looked at this information, and this would not be something they would look at, further indicating that anyone who made such charges was blinded by their hatred of President Bush.

Which leads back to the interviews of guests on the three television news programs. The main theme of all three of the guests on these programs appeared to be concern of the physical evidence of 9/11/2001, mentioned above and particularly regarding the collapse of three of the World Trade Center buildings on that day.

The main themes of the interviewers on these programs appeared to be two-fold:
1) The guests were representing a fringe movement, and most Americans do not dispute the official 9/11 explanation of the 19 hijackers defeating US military and intelligence forces on 9/11/2001.
2) The guests and those they speak for, who question the official 9/11/2001 account, are of questionable sanity

This motivated me to do some research. First I looked at the fringe movement issue that the majority of Americans disagreed with the programs guests and accept the official explanation, and secondly, the sanity and expertise of people like their guests who question the official story of 9/11/2001.

First, regarding the fringe issue, asserting that the guests questioning the events of 9/11 reflected a small minority of American opinion. I looked at the only polls I could find on these questions, and the results were surprising. A CNN viewers poll, which is not scientific, held Wednesday, November 10th, 2005, asked, "Do you believe there is a U.S. government cover-up surrounding 9/11?" 89% replied "Yes," they did believe there was a cover-up by the U.S. Government (9,441 votes), while only 12% felt there was no cover-up. In a national Zogby poll, of May 2006, found that 45%, of the American public felt a new 9/11 investigation should be launched because "so many unanswered questions about 9/11 remain that Congress or an International Tribunal should re-investigate the attacks, including whether any US government officials consciously allowed or helped facilitate their success." An earlier Zogby poll of New York City residents, from August of 2004, found that Half (49.3%) of New Yorkers felt that U.S. government officials "knew in advance that attacks were planned on or around September 11, 2001, and that they consciously failed to act." While 66% of New Yorkers called for a new probe of Unanswered Questions by Congress or New York’s Attorney General.

Now to the second issue the television media interviewers were most concerned with, which was the expertise and sanity of the people demanding a new 9/11 investigation, and some even suggesting possible U.S. government complicity in the attacks of 9/11/2001. Again, a simple google "video 9/11" search, provided a wealth of information. This too yielded some surprising results.

One of the loudest advocates of the most damning charge that "members of the U.S. government actually orchestrated the events of 9/11 to fool the nation into unpopular wars", was not a tree-hugging Green Party activist, but rather a prominent Republican, in fact a Former Chief Economist under George Bush, and professor at Texas A&M, Morgan Reynolds.  http://www.lewrockwell.com/reynolds/reynolds12.html

Google research of the growing list of other 9/11 skeptics of the official story, some "convinced of U.S. government involvement," while others not going that far, but pointing out that"the official story is highly questionable and demands further investigation," yielded surprising results. Including a host of high level Republican administration officials, defense experts, intelligence experts, and respected scholars, as well as well known celebrities who are now adding the spotlight of their names to the issue of 9/11. Among them were:

Former Director of Advanced Space Programs Development for the U.S.
Air Force, under President Reagan, and combat fighter pilot Col. Robert Bowman (Caltech Phd in aeronautics and nuclear engineering).  http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6900065571556128674

Former CIA Intelligence Advisor to Reagan and George HW Bush and
founder of the Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, Ray McGovern
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Researchers_questioning_the_official_account_of_9/11

Kevin Ryan, former department head at UL (Underwriter Laboratories) the company which certified the steel which went into the WTCs upon their construction, and inspected it after the WTC collapses in 2001.
 http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20041112144051451

Former assistant secretary of the U.S. Treasury Senior Research
Fellow at the Hoover Institution, Research Fellow at Stanford's Independent Institute,
and former associate editor of the Wall Street Journal, Paul Craig Roberts
 http://www.wanttoknow.info/050908insidejob911#roberts

Canadian National Defense Minister, the Honourable Paul Hellyer
 http://www.septembereleventh.org/kc/multimedia/movies/Hellyer.mov

Minister for the Environment, and Member of Parliament (United Kingdom) Michael Meacher
 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8274552561914055825

National Minister of Defense (Germany). Also, served as Minister of Technology Andreas Von Bulow
 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8274552561914055825

Former Chief of Staff of the Russian armed forces, and chief of the
department for General affairs in the Soviet Union 's ministry of Defense, General
Leonid Ivashov
 http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=NIM20060123&articleId=1788

Former MI6 British Counter Intelligence Officer, David Shayler
 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5403286136814574974

Distinguished McKnight University Professor of Philosophy at the University of Minnesota, former Marine Corps officer, author or editor of more than 20
books, and co-chair of Scholars For 9/11 Truth, James Fetzer
 http://www.911podcasts.com/display.php?vid=122

Professor of Physics, Brigham Young University, and co-chair of
Scholars For 9/11 Truth, Steven Jones
 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=964034652002408586

Emeritus Professor of Philosophy of Religion & Theology, Claremont
Graduate University, and author or editor of some 30 books, including "The New Pearl Harbor" and "The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions" David Ray Griffin
 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6837001821567284154

Professor of mathematics, University of Western Ontario, and founder
of the Scientific Panel Investigating Nine-Eleven (SPINE), A.K Dewdney
 http://www.serendipity.li/wot/operation_pearl.htm
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A._K._Dewdney

Aircraft crash investigation authority, USAF Col. (Ret) George Nelson
 http://www.physics911.net/georgenelson.htm

Former chief Pentagon arms negotiator for the Middle East, USAF Col.
(Ret) Don de Grand-Pre
 http://www.prisonplanet.com/022904degrand.html

Actor Charlie Sheen (Platoon, Wall Street, etc.)
 http://prisonplanet.com/articles/june2006/280606juggernautoftruth.htm

Actor, Ed Asner
 http://www.911blimp.net/videos/EdAsner-UnityIsTheKey.mov

Actor, Ed Begley, Jr
 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7140359934129245752

So, now that we've examined the two main issues of concern for the television news interviewers, which was the "fringe" aspect of the questioners, and the "sanity/expertise" issue, it appears those arguments are very weak arguments, really with no merit at all. Obviously tens of millions of Americans, according to polls, want a new investigation into 9/11/2001 and have a strong suspicion of U.S. government involvement at some level. Obviously not all of the national defense, intelligence, aeronautics, physics and engineering experts questioning the official story of 9/11 are insane or unqualified to comment.

This begs the question, in the face of such obvious facts, why do our media personalities continue to attempt to throw out accusations that are patently untrue regarding those who question the official story? When a television news interviewer continues to ask questions and make assertions that he or she knows to be untrue, this would challenge the expertise and sanity, not of their guests, but of the television news interviewer.

The 9/11 truth movement appears to be growing rapidly, and involving people of substantial credentials and expertise. As television and some radio personalities continue to behave in what obviously is an insane behavior, what do we do? Can we get our national media any psychological help? If not, it would be wise to relieve them of their positions at least. I feel increasingly uneasy about millions of young minds being exposed night after night to comments and opinions by people who increasingly appear to be insane, yet in positions of authority.

Of course the concern here is larger. If there is any possibility or doubt about whether the events of 9/11/2001 were participated in by members of our own government, then our entire democracy and world peace would be strengthened by getting to the bottom of the true facts of this pinnacle event of our time. It would be unhealthy to leave a cloud of doubt hanging over such assertions. There should be a full fledged national debate, experts from all sides should be interviewed on national media to get to the bottom of this once and for all. Our Congress should launch investigations into the physics questions that are causing so many to doubt the official story. No matter where anyone stands on this issue, this is obviously the only path to national healing and trust.

However, this debate on national media cannot occur if the interviewers hired by national media continue to behave in an insane irrational behavior, like "conspiracy theory wing-nuts." You see, too many of our media spokespersons on television and radio adhere to a wild conspiracy theory. Their theory is that anyone who looks into the facts of the events of one of the most important issues in history is alone, and insane, but yet somehow organized in some united conspiratorial effort. Of course, the facts fly in the face of this conspiracy theory, but these media personalities appear unable to grasp reality even when it is pointed out to them.

For media reading this article, time will tell whether you are an insane conspiracy theorist or not. If you too, are among the insane in our media, the public will likely eventually demand your resignation. As one who writes sometimes on parental issues, I believe it is unhealthy to have insane people in charge of the national information highways our children are taught to watch. We need sane media people who look at facts regarding issues, not ones who launch into insane screeds of paranoia to avoid reality.

Also, you may recall that when I contacted State Representative, Stephen Nass' office, his aid stated that they were aware of but not interested in and would not look at the physics facts provided by the website Scholars for 9/11 Truth, www.st911.org. However, they did want to fire a university teacher for presenting facts, many of which were available on that site. To fire someone for presenting facts, facts that you dispute, yet have no idea what those facts are, and are unwilling to look at them to find out what they are . . . is also insane. Again, as someone who writes on parenting issues, as a concerned parent as well, America should also consider retiring our insane government officials who fire people for facts they aren't aware of and are unwilling to look at. These politicians apparently assert some wild conspiracy theory that millions of Americans are questioning the events of 9/11 because they are "Bush haters" according to the aid at Nass' office. This kind of delusional paranoia by our elected officials is of particular concern. Such wild eyed conspiratorialists should not be allowed in government.



Bill Douglas, author of "The Amateur Parent - A Book on Life, Death, War & Peace, and Everything Else in the Universe"

 findtruth40@hotmail.com
July, 11, 2006

Bill Douglas, author of "The Amateur Parent - A Book on Life, Death, War & Peace
- e-mail: findtruth40@hotmail.com
- Homepage: http://www.st911.org

Comments

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IM-911

12.07.2006 20:43

Okay, you've convinced me, there are no other issues worth posting about ever than 911. The few remaining posts and articles that deal with anything else than 911 should be hidden, unless they somehow link to 911. In fact Indymedia UK should really rename itself as IndyMedia 911 to reflect it's position at the helm of truthseeker journalism.

After all, it a quarter of the visible newswire is crammed with this shite then who does it benefit ? It only damages real activism.

Danny


Hidden Comment

This posting has been hidden because it breaches the Indymedia UK (IMC UK) Editorial Guidelines.

IMC UK is an interactive site offering inclusive participation. All postings to the open publishing newswire are the responsibility of the individual authors and not of IMC UK. Although IMC UK volunteers attempt to ensure accuracy of the newswire, they take no responsibility legal or otherwise for the contents of the open publishing site. Mention of external web sites or services is for information purposes only and constitutes neither an endorsement nor a recommendation.

The Lunatics have taken over the asylum

12.07.2006 21:22

Danny, if you keep an eye on the features list you'll notice that two admins have taken it upon themselves to facilitate IMUK being a pro conspiracy as possible and if you check the hidden comments with the ?c=all then you'll find dissent hidden whilst the 9/11 loons get to be as abusive as they like.

All this shit is makig the site nigh on pointless for posting real activist issues.

Anyone fancy a coup detat?

No, doubt this will get hidden an I'll have to just post it as a newsitem to be left at all visible.

Off to the tinfoil Gulag with me.

Chomsky Fan


I disagree

12.07.2006 21:36

I don't agree with you

domino
mail e-mail: domino-theory@lycos.com
- Homepage: http://domino-theory@tripod.com


i disagreee

12.07.2006 21:59

i disagree

do


Fanclubs are for teenagers

13.07.2006 00:04

I gave someone a Chomsky book once, and they wrote off to his publishers asking if he had a fan club. He wrote back saying if there was a fan club he would be 'banging on it's dooors to get it to disband'. So you are on your own.

Ach, you'll get hidden, deleted, banned or murdered, or worse, on any forum if you are too abusive even if you are in the censor agrees with you. I don't mind when the 911ers are abusive, that would be hypocritical of me as I'm often embarrassed reading what I've typed when I was drunk or angry, but I do mind when they knock real news off the visible newswire by posting yet another 911 post when there is still one visible that they could add their tuppence to. I do mind that they have all these 911 sites and this is an activist site being overrun by non-activist shit, it seems beneficial only to the powers that be to prefer speculation over action. I think that is why it is important to congratulate DH/Dizzy for organising a meeting about 911 in Yorkshire - at least he is approaching the subject like an activist and may eventually have real activist news for the wire, whether we believe in his current issue or not. Deeds before words.

"All this shit is makig the site nigh on pointless for posting real activist issues."

And the double-whammy is that even responding to it is disruptive to real news and only serve to highlight the non-news. Stop complaining at the immorality of your opponents successful tactics and adopt the same until the practice is banned. When you see an update on any issue that interests you, don't post it as a comment under an existing story but post it as a new story, just like the 'truthseekers' do. It would make issues disappear faster but it would remove the predominance of unchallenged and unresponded to 911 theories from the frontpage. Although opposing the 911ers you do end up with long and much viewed threads, which seems to give IM even more of a domination of conspiracy theory discussion rather than activist reportage.

"Anyone fancy a coup detat? "

How about a coup de boule instead ? A coup d'etat means volunteering for IM, that seems like hard work better suited to you rather than me. Then there is the humiliation of the initiation ceremony into IM, who would willingly a hamster up theirr arse? This isn't a criticism of IM but it is surprising how much activist activity can be organised on non-activist websites. It's not just the BNP who recruit from football forums for example, though the same holds true for a surprising diversity of forums. Some disparate groups just have activist holidays, which is to be encouraged. You could maybe run package holidays for them and arrange holiday insurance for SOCPA fines.

Da


When the word 'activism' means 'protect Blair at all costs'

13.07.2006 03:09

With Levy arrested, some people here are going into full panic mode. Of course if they could have audience with their master, Blair would tell them to calm the hell down, things are NOT as they seem. Meantime they scream for REAL 'activism', by which they mean, of course, the activism equivalent of a hollywood film 'explosion', namely an event that in reality is merely noise and light, but is designed to look convincing.

911 was Blair's ultimate act of ACTIVISM. By this one event, Blair and his people were able to launch the invasions of two nations. The subsequent misery in Afghanistan is disgustingly under-reported. None of you have that excuse with Iraq.

Those that scream blue murder about all the dedicated effort spent in a genuine attempt to bring down the regimes of Bush and Blair by examining the truth of 911 want above all else for you to forget about the depravity that their master has unleashed on the muslim peoples of two sovereign nations. Empathy with these humans must be discouraged at all costs, so that Blair's next war against Iran can be eased into existence.

For these people 'activism' must NEVER mean acting effectively against the greatest evil the Human Race ever faces, AGGRESSIVE WAR. No, for these people, 'activism' means re-arranging the deckchairs of the Titanic.

Take a simple example. What is 'anti-racist' 'activism' according to these people? Would that be fighting against the political party in the UK DIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE for the genocide of more than a million Humans in Iraq as a result of sanctions (sanctions that were held in place by British and Israeli programs of forged evidence presenting the lie of Iraq's non-compliance)? Would that be fighting against the political party in the UK DIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE for the murder of over half a million Humans in Iraq as a result of Blair's invasion? Would that be fighting the political party in the UK directly responsible for the atrocities daily inflicted on the Humans of Gaza by the Israelis as a direct consequence of that same party working to declare all Palestinian institutions terrorist across the EU, and glorifying every Israeli act of terror.

No, for these New Reich supporters, 'anti-racist' activism is street-fighting against members of the BNP, an New Reich distraction psy-op.

To these people, 'activism' is ensuring that people don't read the words of Dahl Jamail, or visit uruknet.info . For them, 'activism' is protecting Blair at all costs, by attempting to herd those good people who want a better world into 'safe' 'harmless' activities that can do no damage to Blair, or any of his programs.

Nazi Germany was alive with such 'activism'. Go watch the propaganda films from the time. Such 'activism' formed the very heart of nazi social control programs.

The supporters of Blair's New Reich party have the blood of millions on their hands. They want to wash this off with the blood of hundreds of millions, and this can only happen if Blair gets to end this phase of his program of aggressive wars, and start the next, with his planned GENOCIDE of Iran.

These supporters KNOW that Putin's people were caught red-handed planting an apartment bomb in Moscow during the false-flag bombings that Putin used to win power and genocide Chechnya. They are literally terrified that Blair's 911 false-flag will yet produce a similar smoking-gun that convinces the whole world of the true events, destroying their master.

Like Mike O'Brian laughing his way through his Channel 4 News interview about Levy, and New Reich corruption, they use the same ghoulish technique, giggling and smirking when confronted with the evidence of the evil that they have inflicted on whole populations of Humans.

So make your choice, dear readers. Do as they say, and stick to reading your Guardian, buying your 'fair-trade' coffee, and listening to your U2 records, passively watching as Blair progresses to his genocide of Iran, Palestine, Cuba, and Venezuela. Or let YOUR 'activism' flow from an exploding rage that the world must not be allowed to fall once again into a World War, planned and executed by the genocidal maniac Blair, and his supporters.

twilight


.

13.07.2006 07:17

Is twatlight proposing a jihad?

I think your a muslim goon hard at word creating a muslim psyop. Your goal to link blair to any post on this site and then spout bollocks and spurious links to blair.

I have no doubt your paid per use of riech (incidently is this what your jihad masters want when the 'black flag of Islam is flying over downing street), goon, nazi and psy ops.

Are you gonna kiss our collective asses when you proved so wrong its hurts, that is when blair steps down and can noo longer operate as your femme fatal.

.


So make your choice, dear readers

13.07.2006 12:01

Twilights paranoia normally masks their arrogance, hypocritical inactivity and impotence but not in that latest post.

Is Indymedia about 'examining the truth of 911' or about activism ? As Twilight indicate, the two are mutually exclusive, Indymedia can either be an activist site or it can be a site for the investigation of 911.

Take Twi'ts 'simple example' as it it is a perfect example. He claims anyone who fights the BNP is a Blairite stooge. He claims real anti-racist activism would be attacking New Labour in Iraq and working for the people of Iraq and Palestine. I fight fascism on the street, but I also fight New Labour and against both occupations, so am I a stooge or a 'human' ?

I challenge Twilight to link to an Indymedia article about any anti-occupation action that they have organised or been arrested on ? If Twilight can't then then what does Twilights activism amounts to writing posts he admits are non-activisit on an activist website. Why would someone sane do that when there are plenty of 911 sites to post on ? The only effects of it are to stop activists reading IM and to overwrite real actions on the newswire and to discredit often genuine ideas and causes by mad exaggeration and outlandish science-fiction storylines.Twilights use of the word 'human' to refer to only some people - ie any victims of our states policy - may seem to indicate an empathy with those victims. Unfortunately, it isn't a metaphor, Twi't really believes the earth is controlled by shapeshifting lizard-men living amongst us. If Twilights empathy for Iraq and Palestine is genuine rather than fraudulent platitudes why can't he link to actions, events and arrests here ?

Twilight goes all Jane Austen and says 'So make your choice, dear readers', and I've made my choice. Life is too short for this shit and people are dying while we are having to respond to trashy teenage fantasists accusing anyone anti-fascist of being Blairite. Personally, I've often called for Blairs assasination here so I dislike that false stereotype even more than the U2 slander.


The fact the admins are allowing regular posts and links to and about Rense, an awful Nazi propaganda site, shows the current admins either share Twilights disdain of anti-fascists or are idiots, I'm unsure which. Someone else suggested a coup d'etat here, which means joining in numbers as admins and then administering the Guidelines properly, but I've no time for that nor the temper, I'd rather be outside doing stuff. Someone email me if the admins start hiding all this 911 white-noise and I'll maybe post some photos of what I've been up to in my summer holidays. Until then, keep watching the skies !

Danny


Danny...

13.07.2006 12:57

Please report any posts that link to anti-semitic sites like Rense to the admins,  http://lists.indymedia.org/imc-uk-features - if there is stuff linking to sites that host anti-semitic content they will hide them, the chance is that thay haven't seen them...

As for Twilight's posts, well I suspect the problem is that most admins can't stand them and don't actually read them, this is also probably the case for most readers of the site. Should his posts always be hidden? I don't know, it's hard to know if one doesn't actually read them.

Twilight's "my enemy's enemy is my friend" stuff is clearly total crap - he feaks out when Outrage point out the Iran's government is doing awful things because he thinks that Iran's rulling class needs supporting against the rulling class of the USA, when in reality neither rulling class is acting in the interests of the working class of either state (as usual).

Sometimes the old slogans are still the best:

No War But the Class War!

The Main Enemy is at Home!

No Borders! No States! No Nations!

As for posts that are not grass roots activism reporting, the promoted newswire is supposed to help here... did you try viewing the front page using that, did this help?

The coup suggestion is odd, the nature of Indymedia is such that it is possible to have several sites covering the same area - San Fransisco has two for example, however there isn't really much indication that anyone else is thinking this apart from "Chomsky Fan" - take a look at the Indymedia admin lists for example, who else is raising this as an issue...?

Watcher


Danny

13.07.2006 13:08

I'm thinking along the same lines.

This place is beginning to make me feel like the Internet is the worst to happen to activism. It's virtual activism, a load of old waffle- as if the SWP and Anarchist social centres don't generate enough hot air to solve the renewable energy argument.

Does posting reports about actions here amount to anything constructive if it's only loons and bigots reading them anyway?

I'm thinking that the 19th century way of doing things may be better= paper (recycled & acid free... preferably stolen too!)

Chomsky's biggest fan XXX OXO SWALK!


Lotta Bluster, Little Substance. Sadly Typical

13.07.2006 15:01

It's interesting how much effort the supporters of Bush/PNAC, Plants, and other defenders of the Official Conspiracy Theory - the singular fable upon which they've launched their long-planned, radical, Neo-Fascist agenda of military Aggression and Madness - spend creating and spreading such Disinformation, as opposed to finding the still-missing key, compelling, and independently-originating and verifiable evidence which would exist - and be forthcoming - if this "See? We HAVE to slaughter Arabs" Conspiracy Theory were true.

I have noticed, however, that the desperate increase in this type of BS happens to coincide with the 911 Truth Movement and these claims leeching into the mainstream, and being supported (at least in part) by a large majority of citizens, even in America, with its tightly-controlled media and insulated, highly-conditioned society.

If you think you can prove the Bush/PNAC Conspiracy Theory, then DO IT ALREADY!!!

If not, save it, Plant.

911 = PNAC, CIA, Mossad


Don't counterpose thoughts and actions!

13.07.2006 15:29

"it seems beneficial only to the powers that be to prefer speculation over action"

Discussion, analysis, research and such like seem to be important things if you want you undertake informed actions, counterposing these things makes no sense.

Teenage Werewolf


Kindergarden Goebbels

13.07.2006 16:09

Watcher,
I didn't see the point in reporting Rense links as there as so many of them I assumed they were deemed acceptable. If they have just been innocently slipping through then I apologise to the admins and I will collate a list and report those links in the next few days. I avoided using the promoted newswire as there are unpromoted articles posted which I'm interested in, but I will use it as default from now on to keep up to date with what others are up to. I read the coup suggestion as an attempt to get more people to volunteer as admins rather than as a call for guillotines. "The Main Enemy is at Home! " Is that really a slogan or do you just know my sister ? Oh, Karl Liebknecht. "Learn everything, don't forget anything!" seems very apt. thanks for that.


Chomsky Fan,
most posters on IM aren't virtual activists, they are reporting real actions. Most 911 posters don't have any pretensions of being active and show contempt for anyone who tries to do anything positive, so you can't even call them 'virtual-activists'. There are so many real and disparate actions still posted here that there must be a lot of people who read this site without ever commenting on posts, and so I think the few vocal and repetitive 'loons and bigots' give a false and demotivating impression of the site. It is tempting to just post actions on other sites to try to inspire similar actions from people who don't see themselves as activists, but it would be silly not to post them here as well, that's just giving up an activist site for no reason. I don't know if it is worth responding to the 911 posts but if you have the patience and time then well done but they win if you spend more time doing that than responding to real posts or doing your own actions. Don't lump them all together, I try to differentiate between them :

1- Propagandists ( like the fascist Larouche cult which the CIA use to disrupt peacemovements ) and who are a real danger to us.
2 - Gullible fantasists who drawn to mysteries but never actually leave their PCs and are a danger only to themselves.
3 - Genuine folk who have a healthy distrust of any official story.

I think the original article is a text-book piece of propaganda, a pro-911 Conspiracy post masquerading as an condemnation of 911 Conspiracists. Kindergarden Goebbels techniques that should be challenged and ridiculed or hidden, but then I'm not prepared to be an admin so that is just opinion I also think a lot of the genuine folk may in time decide to become activists rather than 'investigators' and shouldn't be dismissed casually with the others.

As for pen and paper, I've forgotten how to write except to make my mark at the dole office. I prefer the 20th century aersol bomb as a writing implement though I just bought some powered paint to use to smuggle in and decorate the next cell I am in.


911=Fruitcake,

I'm pretty sure I can prove any official story to be a lie, I can also prove you are far from being a real investigator and are certainly no activist - in fact you've proved that yourself - and so why are you posting your speculations on an activist website ? Why don't you post on a 911 website ?

Danny


Distraction is disinformation.

13.07.2006 16:22

There you go again Jordan with your evasions. Rather than admitting that your assertions are 100% fantasy you go accusing anyone who disagrees with you as supporting Bush etc.

You're like a little kid with chocoalte all round his mouth saying "Ni, it wasn't ME that stole the chocolate!"

Grow up!

Highly Amused


Thanks For Proving My Point, Plant

13.07.2006 17:31

It's interesting how much effort the supporters of Bush/PNAC, Plants, and other defenders of the Official Conspiracy Theory - the singular fable upon which they've launched their long-planned, radical, Neo-Fascist agenda of military Aggression and Madness - spend creating and spreading such Disinformation, as opposed to finding the still-missing key, compelling, and independently-originating and verifiable evidence which would exist - and be forthcoming - if this "See? We HAVE to slaughter Arabs" Conspiracy Theory were true.

I have noticed, however, that the desperate increase in this type of BS happens to coincide with the 911 Truth Movement and these claims leeching into the mainstream, and being supported (at least in part) by a large majority of citizens, even in America, with its tightly-controlled media and insulated, highly-conditioned society, directing questions that the Bush/PNAC fanatics are incapable of addressing.

If you think you can prove the Bush/PNAC Conspiracy Theory, then DO IT ALREADY!!!

If not, save it, Plant.

911=PNAC, CIA, Mossad


But you have no point!

13.07.2006 18:57

You're just a bigotted cut&paste monkey for Alex Jone$ & Ren$e.

Run along now like a good little acolyte.

Laughing even harder


Don't expose the 9/11 Conspiracy Wingnuts

13.07.2006 19:30

Just ignore them. There's no point in arguing or dicussing the issue. The 9/11 "truth" movement seems to be mostly composed of fanatics who spent every waking moment pushing it on others.

Dr. Common Sense


.... zzz ... wake me up when you have something to say

14.07.2006 07:33

A lot of posts (posters?) aimed at rididcule of other posters.

No analysis.

No additional info.

No suggested research.

No call to demo's.

No info on action.

... And they have the gall to decry other posistions as lazy, indolent, inactive & ... what? ... too wordy?

Therein lies the crux of the matter ... w/ chip on shoulder, anti-intellectualism raises its immature head.

Go ahead, knock yourselves out - formulate action without recourse to analysing the problem first, rush in screaming and unfurling some impressive banners ... but act quickly as you want to first, loudest, biggest betterest ... the darlin of the demo ...

Meanwhile your pipsqueek philosophies have enough time to bash out a few short sentences that exactly outline your depth and committment.

So this new better world you are building (we would join in but are too busy sitting around on our paranoid arses looking for special interest groups to slander and defame - after all, we are'nt as interested in justice and truth as you all action jocks) ... there is no opposition to it is there?

Yes?

And there undermining you?

What they killed some folk and stole there stuff?

Noooo ... they can't be that bad, a quick demo will sort them out surely?

Who are they again?

What do they want again?

Oh, it's so complicated now, I think I'll just go home for a while until someone can explain whats going on ... not you lot, you fucking intellectuals and your fucking attempts at intigrating every bit of info into a workable theory that does not exclude any truth ...

... when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, is the truth ...

tin foil.
lizards
the greys
more tinfoil
nazies
yet more tin foil

... see, those are the only words you need to dismiss anything that is too complicated to feature on the wright stuff et al ...

...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz ...

23 lines of snooze ...

23 winks


23 Skidoo

14.07.2006 14:31

April 19th = 19/4 = 19+4= 23

1529 Diet of Speyer begins the protestant movement
1775 War of Independence starts at Lexington-Concord
1943 Warsaw Ghetto Uprising
1961 Bay of Pigs fails
1993 Waco burns
1995 Oklahoma bombing
2000 Phillipine airliner disater
2005 Ratzinger elected Pope


See the pattern ?


October 13th = 13/10 =13+10=23
1307 Knights Templar routed by Philip the Fair
1792 Cornerstone of the Whitehouse is laid
1843 The B'nai B'rith Jewish service organization is founded in New York
1917 The "Miracle of the Sun" is witnessed by 70,000 in Fatima, Portugal.
1943 Italy joins the allies
1946 France adopts the constitution of the Fourth Republic.
1972 Moscow air disaster
1972 Crash in the Andes -"Old Christians" rugby team turn to cannabilism
1976 Bolivian air disater
1977 Lufthansa hijacking


How about now ? 911 ?

9+1+1= 20
2+0+01=3
20+3=23

You have 23 days in your biorythm cycle.
It takes 23 seconds for blood to circulate around your system.
Your parents each give you 23 chromosomes
There are 23 joints in your arm

You will notice the number 23 each day for the next 23 days.


Illumini


Still Nothing, That's Disinformation

14.07.2006 15:36

It's interesting how much effort the supporters of Bush/PNAC, Plants, and other defenders of the Official Conspiracy Theory - the singular fable upon which they've launched their long-planned, radical, Neo-Fascist agenda of military Aggression and Madness - spend creating and spreading such Disinformation, as opposed to finding the still-missing key, compelling, and independently-originating and verifiable evidence which would exist - and be forthcoming - if this "See? We HAVE to slaughter Arabs" Conspiracy Theory were true.

I have noticed, however, that the desperate increase in this type of BS happens to coincide with the 911 Truth Movement and these claims leeching into the mainstream, and being supported (at least in part) by a large majority of citizens, even in America, with its tightly-controlled media and insulated, highly-conditioned society, directing questions that the Bush/PNAC fanatics are incapable of addressing.

If you think you can prove the Bush/PNAC Conspiracy Theory, then DO IT ALREADY!!!

If not, save it, Plant.

Bush/PNAC The Wild Conspiracy Nuts - They've Been Exposed, as LIARS & Tyrants


justified ancients of mumu

14.07.2006 16:02

Why would a supposed truthseeker call a list of facts 'disinformation' ? Where exactly have I lied ?


December 11th = 11/12 = 11+12 = 23

1282 - The last native Prince of Wales, was killed
1792 - French Revolution: King Louis XVI of France is put on trial for treason by the National Convention.
1936 - Edward VIII's Abdication Crisis
1941 - Germany and Italy declare war on the United States.
1964 - Terrorists fire a mortar shell at the UN building during a speech by Che Guevara
1971 - The Libertarian Party of the United States is formed.
1981 - El Mozote massacre: Salvadoran armed forces kill an estimated 900 civilians
1994 - First Chechen War: Russian President Boris Yeltsin orders Russian troops into Chechnya
1994 - A bomb explodes on Philippine Airlines Flight 434
1997 - The Kyoto Protocol opens for signature.
1998 - A Thai Airways Airbus A310-200 crashes
2001 - The People's Republic of China joins the WTO
2005 - The Buncefield Oil Depot explosions
2005 - Sydney race riots




There are 23 letters in the Latin alphabet

W = 23rd letter of the alphabet
It's symbol is 2 points down, 3 up.

W, the only letter in the English language to be renounced polysyllabically, is 23rd in line. Note also that it is a double(2)-u and that t has three(3) syllables.

WWW = 23+23+23 = 69

69/3 = 23 -> 6+9+3 = 18 = 23-5 (2+3=5)

2 / 3 = .666

23 is the first prime number in which both digits are prime numbers and add up to another prime number.

Two (2), three (3), and five(5) are the first three prime numbers in our counting system. (1 is not prime, it's an identity).

Square root(s) of 2,3, and 5 are used in respect to tetrahedral hyperdimensional physics and perfect form in design. Square root(s)of 2, 3, and 5 supposedly relative to D&M Pyramid on Mars and other similar relationships. Also these square roots were quite common in early architecture and considered the most aesthetically pleasing in design.

23 written in base 3 is 212 (2+1+2=5)
23 written in base 4 is 113 (1+1+3=5)
23 written in base 7 is 32 (3+2=5)

23 Axioms in Euclid's Geometry.

Pentagram: the angle between the rays of a symmetrical-pointed star is 72 degrees. Also, the angle between legs of a pentagon is 108 degrees (the complementary angle of 108 is 72(108+72=180)). (2^3)*(3^2)=2*3*2*3*2=72. (Note that 5 (2^2)*(3^3)=3*2*3*2*3=58. Numbers are 2*3*2*3*5=180 multiplied in each equation.)

Two-thirds of numbers which are divisible by 2 are not multiples of 3.

In the Qabalistic Tree of Life, the 23rd path is associated with the Hanged Man Tarot Card. Aleister Crowley also states that this card represents the concept that the only way OUT is WITHIN!

illumini


Admins

14.07.2006 16:08

Still Nothing, That's Disinformation

14.07.2006 17:36

is abusive and disruptive.

Adult Reader


psychic tv

14.07.2006 16:42

So on all these 23 related days , supernatural events, disasters and significant political events occur - which also include 911 - and yet a 911 investigator dismisses it as 'disinformation'. Curious. I've managed to link the Kings Templar to the protestant revolt to illumitti to Popes to Presidents and every sorts of catastrophes and massacres. Strange then that the 911 investigators aren't all over these important and revealing and unchallenged facts. I can only surmise they are trying to hide the significance of this for some reason. Oh yes - disinformation.

Truthseeking means seeking out what you don't know rather than trying to fit the facts to prove your intuitions.


September 14th = 14/9 = 14+9 = 23

1829 - Ottoman Empire signs the Treaty of Adrianople with Russia.
1901 - President of the United States William McKinley dies after an assassination attempt on September 6, and is succeeded by Theodore Roosevelt.
1917 - Republican government declared in Russia.
1923 - Miguel Primo de Rivera becomes dictator of Spain.
1948 - Groundbreaking for the United Nations headquarters in New York City.
1959 - The Soviet probe Luna 2 becomes the first man-made object to reach it.
1960 - The Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) is founded.
1964 - The opening of the third period of the Second Vatican Council.
1965 - The opening of the fourth and final period of Second Vatican Council.
1969 - On December 1, 1969 September 14th is drawn as the first birthdate in the U.S. draft
1975 - The first American saint, Elizabeth Ann Seton, is canonized by Pope Paul VI.
1999 - Kiribati, Nauru and Tonga join the United Nations.
2001 - Prayer Service held at Washington National Cathedral for victims of 911.
2003 - Estonia approves joining the European Union in a referendum.

May 18th = 18/5 = 18+5 = 23


1268 - The Principality of Antioch, a crusader state, falls to the Mamluk Sultan Baibars in the Battle of Antioch
1593 - Playwright Thomas Kyd's accusations of heresy lead to an arrest warrant for Christopher Marlowe.
1652 - Rhode Island passes the first law in North America making slavery illegal.
1803 - Napoleonic Wars: The United Kingdom revokes the Treaty of Amiens and declares war on France.
1804 - Napoleon Bonaparte is proclaimed Emperor of France by the French Senate.
1811 - Las Piedras Battle first great military triumph of the liberating revolution of the Río de la Plata in Uruguay leaded by Jose Artigas.
1848 - Opening of the first German National Assembly (Nationalversammlung) in Frankfurt, Germany.
1869 - Surrender and dissolution of the Ezo Republic to Japan.
1897 - Dracula, a novel by Irish author Bram Stoker is published.
1910 - The Earth passes through the tail of Comet Halley.
1917 - World War I: The Selective Service Act passes the U.S. Congress giving the President the power of conscription.
1926 - Evangelist Aimee Semple McPherson disappears while visiting a Venice, California, beach.
1927 - The Bath School Disaster: Forty-five people are killed by bombs planted by a disgruntled school-board member in Michigan.
1944 - World War II: Battle of Monte Cassino - Germans evacuate Monte Cassino and Allied forces take the stronghold after a struggle that claimed 20,000 lives.
1944 - Deportation of Crimean Tatars by the Soviet Union government.
1974 - Nuclear test: Under project Smiling Buddha, India successfully detonates its first nuclear weapon becoming the sixth nation to do so.
1980 - 1980 Mount St. Helens eruption: Mount St. Helens erupts in Washington, killing 57 people and causing $3 billion in damage.
1980 - Gwangju Massacre
1980 - Perus Shining Path attacked a voting poll, starting their activities.
1991 - 18th May, Chinese Natural Disaster, Flood killing 210,232,227.
2006 - The post Loktantra Andolan government passes a landmark bill curtailing the power of the monarchy and making Nepal a secular country.



There are 23 vertebrae in the human body

The ideal orbit for a satellite is 23,000 miles above the Earth

The Earth is tilted at an angle of 23.5 degrees (At the moment)

A hedgehog maintains a metabolic temperature of 23 degrees

There is a mass extinction every 23 Ma

It's -23 celcius on Mars

The Germans had 23 divisions on the Western Front in 1940 versus 110+ French

Charlie Company - the troops responsible for the My Lai 4 massacre in Vietnam belonged 23rd division of the US Army

illumini


A Letter to the Peace & Justice Community from Actor, Ed Asner, a long time acti

22.07.2006 08:14

Dear Peace & Justice Leader(s),

I am Ed Asner. As you may know, I've dedicated much of my life to promoting peace & justice issues in America.

I would like to suggest to you emphatically that the 9-11 truth movement is the most pressing issue of the peace & justice movement today. Here is why. 9-11 has been used to justify "endless war" and a continual rollback in civil liberties that seems to have no end in sight. Yet, 9-11 remains the least examined tragedy in modern American history.

Americans would have never agreed to the last two wars and the Patriot Act's disturbing policy . . . had it not been for 9-11.

There are many disturbing issues around 9-11 that have yet to be examined in any meaningful way by our media, Congress, and even by the 9-11 Commission. These include accountability for the massive breakdown of air defense and plane intercept procedures as described in FAA and DOD regulations, which were violated on 9-11.

This breakdown and astounding unpreparedness by U.S. domestic defense agencies is puzzling to say the least, given the detailed reports our government had of the coming attacks, that were bizarrely suppressed by key officials.

For example, FBI Agent Coleen Rowley suggested that her offices' attempts to alert higher ups in the FBI of the pre 9-11 activities of Zacharias Moussaoui "seemed to have been consistently, almost DELIBERATELY thwart[ed] . . ." While George Tenet, Director of the CIA, had recieved a memo in August of 2001 (one month before the attacks of 9-11) on this report entitled, "Islamic Extermists Learn to Fly." Yet, Tenet took no action on this memo. The FBI agents responsible for the now famous "Phoenix Memo" regarding Osama Bin Laden sending students to the U.S. to attend civil aviation schools, also struggled to get their higher ups to act on this information.

To date, no one has been held accountable for the massive defense failures on 9-11, nor for the bizarre suppression of critical warnings prior to 9-11. Furthermore, we still have no explanation for why the head of Pakistani intelligence, who was meeting with top Bush Administration officials in Washington on 9-11-2001, had wired lead hijacker Mohammed Atta $100,000.00 weeks before 9-11. We still do not know who made the insider stock trades in weeks and days leading up to 9-11, by betting "against" United and American Airlines stocks (the aircraft used as missiles on 9-11).

What we DO KNOW is that $5 million of those insider stock trade "winnings" apparently by someone who had foreknowledge of the coming attacks, were made the day before 9-11 at AB Brown Trust. AB Brown Trust was headed until his induction into the CIA by Buzzy Krongard, who is now the Executive Director of the CIA. We also know that the current head of AB Brown Trust quietly resigned his position on 9-11, with no media scrutiny nor apparently government scrutiny.

Lastly, and perhaps most bizarre is the fact that $2.5 million of those stock "winnings" against these airlines made at AB Brown Trust . . . remain unclaimed.

We deserve to know why no one has been held accountable, and who made those insider stock trades. We also deserve to know why the Bush Administration allowed members of the Bin Laden family to quietly leave the U.S. after 9-11, with virtually no questioning by the FBI, and at a time when other Americans were not allowed to fly.

There are many other profound, and bizarrely "unasked" questions around 9-11. I urge all to read "The New Pearl Harbor: Disturbing Questions About the Bush Administration and 9/11" by David Ray Griffin, and introduced by Howard Zinn, and to view "The Great Deception" documentary by acclaimed Canadian television journalist Barry Zwicker. Peace & justice leaders and activists will find these works a great resource for getting current on the 9-11 truth issue, and can be great organizing tools to educate others.

I fear that if the underlying issues of 9-11 truth are not demanded, that Iraq may be but a flame on an ocean of gasoline that may be used to ignite war after war after war. We cannot, as a peace & justice movement only address the flames. We must look at the fuel being used to justify the flames of war and repression at home and abroad. We must look deeply at the events leading up to, on and since 9-11. We must demand full 9-11 truth.

I encourage all local and national peace & justice activists and organizations to join Philadelphia Peace Action and other peace & justice organizations nationwide who are now beginning to work with and becoming involved with the National 911Visibility.org Project at www.911Visibility.org and to list your local efforts contact information there, so 9-11 truth activists across the nation can get involved with you to demand full 9-11 truth.

National 911Visibility.org has worked with 9-11 family members, and become a media source conducting interviews and linking media with 9-11 family members, including BBC World Wide Radio Network, The O'Reilly Factor, and others. By listing your local contact information for your local 9-11 truth activities at www.911visibility.org media visiting the site can find your contact information as well as local activists who want to join your efforts.

Sincerely,

Ed Asner

Bill Douglas
mail e-mail: findtruth40@hotmail.com
- Homepage: http://www.st911.org


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