If the poster of the article would deign to respond:

1) How many people travelling from "Chicago to Milwaukee" would worry about being blown to pieces by a suicide bomber?

How many suicide bombings would it take before checkpoints were set up between Chicago and Milwaukee, one or two?

Would one suicide bombing equal one checkpoint? Or would there have to be ten or twenty for every four?

2) What would your response be if your family, through no fault of their own, were faced with the threat of suicide bombings every day?

Would you rather there were checkpoints to defend you, or would you rather there was military retaliation to kill those that run the suicide bomber industry?

3) How many dead Israeli children does it take appease a Hamas commander for the death of a Palestinian child?

I think these are fair questions, so if the poster could respond to them directly before changing the subject, that would be appreciated.

Guess who created the "sucide bomber industry"? The fascist racist zionists with their 50 years of oppression, dehumanisation, torture and murder of Palestinian women and children- they are the sole creators of the suicide bomber. Terrorism was founded when zionist Jews blew up the King David hotel in 1948, murdering Brits and Palestinians, and signalled the start of zionist terror that would engulf the Holy Land for the next 55 years.

If your so worried about "israelis", tell them to stop supporting the mass murderer Sharon and he drenches the land with Palestinian blood, to dismantle their illegal settlements and return to the 1948 borders set out by the UN, to stop destroying the livelihood of Palestinians and to stop from their religious fanaticism which revolves around rebuilding their mythical "third temple" and being the "chosen people"....get the picture? Oh and if you so abhor suicide bombings, perhaps you'd like to donate some funds to hamas to buy apaches so that they can be carry out more precise "targeted assasinations".

... you're proving my point for me, razi. If I don't follow your strict line on every Israeli being a bloodthirsty, baying killer, I'm 'zionist scum'?

Let me explain what I was getting at.

Every action has consequences. Settlers, invasions, shootings and apache attacks lead to suicide bombings. Suicide bombings lead to Israelis wanting checkpoints and Ariel Sharon. The checkpoints weren't there before the intifada.

As for donating money to Hamas, I'm afraid I don't have enough to make a significant donation, when 'significant' is the several billion dollars a year they recieve from Saudi Arabia et al (most of it goes into the leaders' swiss banks accounts).

How many dead Israeli children does it take appease a Hamas commander for the death of a Palestinian child?

People like razi, who see the whole situation in such simple terms, will find out - when the cycle of violence goes on and on. Neither side can win. Either the violence ends or the problem will be solved because everyone will be dead and the entire middle east will be a uninhabitable nuclear wasteland.

Oi! You two! Leave it!

But you might want to see what the IDF chief (surprisingly) makes of the current situation...

***

Chris McGreal in Jerusalem
Friday October 31, 2003
The Guardian

Israel's army chief has exposed deep divisions between the military and Ariel Sharon by branding the government's hardline treatment of Palestinian civilians counter-productive and saying that the policy intensifies hatred and strengthens the "terror organisations".

Lieutenant-General Moshe Ya'alon also told Israeli journalists in an off-the-record briefing that the army was opposed to the route of the "security fence" through the West Bank. The government also contributed to the fall of the former Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas, by offering only "stingy" support for his attempts to end the conflict, he said.

Gen Ya'alon had apparently hoped his anonymous criticisms would strengthen the army's voice, which has been subordinated to the views of the intelligence services in shaping policy.

But the comments were so devastating that he was swiftly revealed as the source.

The statements - which a close associate characterised to the Israeli press as warning that the country was "on the verge of a catastrophe" - will also reinforce a growing perception among the public that Mr Sharon is unable to deliver the peace with security he promised when he came to office nearly three years ago.

The criticism is made all the more searing because Gen Ya'alon is not known for being soft on the Palestinians. As deputy chief of staff, he called the latest conflict the second stage of Israel's independence war.

The general warned that the continued curfews, reoccupation of towns and severe restrictions on the movement of Palestinians, combined with the economic crisis they have caused, were increasing the threat to Israel's security.

"In our tactical decisions, we are operating contrary to our strategic interest," Gen Ya'alon said. "It increases hatred for Israel and strengthens the terror organisations."

Earlier this week, army commanders in the West Bank told the military administration in the occupied territories that Palestinians had reached new depths of despair, which was fuelling a hatred for Israeli that had little to do with the propaganda so often blamed by the government.

"There is no hope, no expectations for the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip, nor in Bethlehem and Jericho," said Gen Ya'alon.

The commanders warned that the situation was strengthening Hamas, a view the Israeli intelligence services agreed with. But while the army sees the solution as easing most oppressive elements of occupation, the Shin Bet argues that rising support for Islamist groups is a reason to keep the clampdown in place. This is the preferred option of the defence minister and Gen Ya'alon's predecessor as army chief of staff, Shaul Mofaz.

Mr Sharon and Mr Mofaz were reportedly furious at the general's statements and initially demanded that he retract them or resign. But the political establishment apparently decided it would be better to deride Gen Ya'alon.

Anonymous sources in the prime minister's office were quoted in the Israeli press complaining that the army chief was trying to blame the politicians for the military's failures.

But army radio reported yesterday that the foreign minister, Silvan Shalom, agreed that there needs to be a substantial easing of restrictions on the Palestinian population. The deputy prime minister, Ehud Olmert, was also reported to have backed the general's view.

Gen Ya'alon also waded into one of the most contentious issues of the day by saying the army had recommended a less controversial route for the steel and concrete "security fence" through the West Bank.

He said the military had warned that the fence, which digs deep into Palestinian territory, caging some towns and villages and cutting farmers off from their land, will make the lives of some Palestinians "unbearable" and require too many soldiers to guard it.

Further questions were raised yesterday after the chairman of parliament's defence budget committee revealed that the cost of the fence could triple to £1.3bn - or 3% of the national budget - if Mr Sharon fulfils his plan for the fence to run around Jewish settlements and the length of the Jordan valley so that it encircles the bulk of the Palestinian population.

there were checkpoints, curfews and closures before the intifada. in fact through the oslo process a whole lot of new checkpoints were erected that, although usually open to most people - as opposed to now -, still checked and controlled palestinians every move and turn.

killing people is wrong. but please, the control on palestinian movement goes far and far beyond any "security protection" for israelis.