I was wrong says Peace Campaigner
Ken Joseph Jnr | 31.03.2003 12:49
Ken Joseph describes how his feelings on war on Iraq, something he was against, but after visiting Iraq and discussing the issue with people there.. `What in the world do you mean?` I asked. `How could you not want peace?` `We don't want peace. We want the war to come` he continued
I Was Wrong!
By Ken Joseph, Jr.
Amman, Jordan
How do you admit you were wrong? What do you do when you realize those you were defending in fact did not want your defense and wanted something completely different from you and from the world?
This is my story. It will probably upset everybody - those with whom I have fought for peace all my life and those for whom the decision for war comes a bit too fast.
I am an Assyrian. I was born and raised in Japan where I am the second generation in ministry after my Father came to Japan in answer to General Douglas Macarthur's call for 10,000 young people to help rebuild Japan following the war.
As a minister and due to my personal convictions I have always been against war for any and all reasons. It was precisely this moral conviction that led me to do all I could to stop the current war in Iraq.
From participating in demonstrations against the war in Japan to strongly opposing it on my radio program, on television and in regular columns I did my best to stand against what I thought to be an unjust war against an innocent people - in fact my people.
As an Assyrian I was told the story of our people from a young age. How my grandparents had escaped the great Assyrian Holocaust in 1917 settling finally in Chicago.
Currently there are approximately six million Assyrians - approximately 1.2 million in Iraq and the rest scattered in the Assyrian Diaspora across the world.
Without a country and rights even in our native land it has been the prayer of generations that the Assyrian Nation will one day be restored and the people of the once great Assyrian Empire will once again be home.
HOME AT LAST
It was with that feeling, together with supplies for our Church and family that I went to Iraq to do all I could to help make a difference.
The feeling as I crossed the border was exhilarating - `home at last, I hought, as I would for the first time visit the land of my forefathers.
The kindness of the border guards when they learned I was Assyrian, the taxi, the people on the street it was like being back `home` after a long absence.
Now I finally know myself! The laid back, relaxed atmosphere, the kindness to strangers, the food, the smells, the language all seemed to trigger a long lost memory somewhere in my deepest DNA.
The first order of business was to attend Church. It was here where my morals were raked over the coals and I was first forced to examine them in the harsh light of reality.
Following a beautiful `Peace` to welcome the Peace Activists in which even the children participated, we moved to the next room to have a simple meal.
`What in the world do you mean?` I asked.
`How could you not want peace?` `We don't want peace. We want the war to come.`
Sitting next to me was an older man who carefully began to sound me out. Apparently feeling the freedom to talk in the midst of the mingling crowd he suddenly turned to me and said `There is something you should know.` `What` I asked surprised at the sudden comment.
`We didn't want to be here tonight`. he continued. `When the Priest asked us to gather for a Peace Service we said we didn't want to come`. He said.
`What do you mean` I inquired, confused. `We didn't want to come because we don't want peace` he replied.
`What in the world do you mean?` I asked. `How could you not want peace?` `We don't want peace. We want the war to come` he continued.
What in the world are you talking about? I blurted back.
That was the beginning of a strange odyssey that deeply shattered my convictions and moral base but at the same time gave me hope for my people and, in fact, hope for the world.
THE STRANGE ODYSSEY BEGINS
Beginning that night and continuing on in the private homes of relatives with whom I stayed little by little the scales began to come off my eyes.
I had not realized it but began to realize that all foreigners in Iraq are subject to 24 hour surveillance by government `minders` who arrange all interviews, visits and contact with ordinary Iraqis. Through some fluke either by my invitation as a religious person and or my family connection I was not subject to any government `minders` at any time throughout my stay in Iraq.
As far as I can tell I was the only person including the media, Human Shields and others in Iraq without a Government `minder` there to guard.
What emerged was something so awful that it is difficult even now to write about it. Discussing with the head of our tribe what I should do as I wanted to stay in Baghdad with our people during their time of trial I was told that I could most help the Assyrian cause by going out and telling the story to the outside world.
Simply put, those living in Iraq, the common, regular people are in a living nightmare. From the terror that would come across the faces of my family at a unknown visitor, telephone call, knock at the door I began to realize the horror they lived with every day.
Over and over I questioned them `Why could you want war? Why could any human being desire war?` They're answer was quiet and measured. `Look at our lives!`We are living like animals. No food, no car, no telephone, no job and most of all no hope.`
I would marvel as my family went around their daily routine as normal as could be. Baghdad was completely serene without even a hint of war. Father would get up, have his breakfast and go off to work. The children to school, the old people - ten in the household to their daily chores.
`You can not imagine what it is to live with war for 20, 30 years. We have to keep up our routine or we would lose our minds`
Then I began to see around me those seemingly in every household who had lost their minds. It seemed in every household there was one or more people who in any other society would be in a Mental Hospital and the ever present picture of a family member killed in one of the many wars.
Having been born and raised in Japan where in spite of 50 years of democracy still retains vestiges of the 400 year old police state I quickly began to catch the subtle nuances of a full blown, modern police state.
I wept with family members as I shared their pain and with great difficulty and deep soul searching began little by little to understand their desire for war to finally rid them of the nightmare they were living in.
The terrible price paid in simple, down to earth ways - the family member with a son who just screams all the time, the family member who lost his wife who left unable to cope anymore, the family member going to a daily job with nothing to do, the family member with a son lost to the war, a husband lost to alcoholism the daily, difficult to perceive slow death of people for whom all hope is lost.
The pictures of Sadaam Hussein whom people hailed in the beginning with great hope everywhere. Sadaam Hussein with his hand outstretched. Sadaam Hussein firing his rifle. Sadaam Hussein in his Arab Headdress. Sadaam Hussein in his classic 30 year old picture - one or more of these four pictures seemed to be everywhere on walls, in the middle of the road, in homes, as statues - he was everywhere!
All seeing, all knowing, all encompassing.
`Life is hell. We have no hope. But everything will be ok once the war is over.` The bizarre desire for a war that would rid them of the hopelessness was at best hard to understand.
`Look at it this way. No matter how bad it is we will not all die. We have hoped for some other way but nothing has worked. 12 years ago it went almost all the way but failed. We cannot wait anymore. We want the war and we want it now`
Coming back to family members and telling them of progress in the talks at the United Nations on working some sort of compromise with Iraq I was welcomed not with joy but anger. `No, there is no other way! We want the war! It is the only way he will get out of our lives`
Once again going back to my Japanese roots I began to understand. The stories I had heard from older Japanese of how in a strange way they had welcomed the sight of the bombers in the skies over Japan.
I had been demonstrating against the war thinking I had been doing it for the very people I was here with now and yet I had not ever bothered to ask them what they wanted.
Of course nobody wanted to be bombed but the first sight of the American B29 Bombers signaled to them that the war was coming to an end. An end was in sight. There would be terrible destruction. They might very well die but finally in a tragic way there was finally hope.
Then I began to feel so terrible. Here I had been demonstrating against the war thinking I had been doing it for the very people I was here now with and yet I had not ever bothered to ask them what they wanted. What they wanted me to do.
It was clear now what I should do. I began to talk to the so called `human shields`. Have you asked the people here what they want? Have you talked to regular people, away from your `minder` and asked them what they want?
I was shocked at the response. `We don't need to do that. We know what they want.` was the usual reply before a minder stepped up to check who I was.
With tears streaming down my face in my bed in a tiny house in Baghdad crowded in with 10 other of my own flesh and blood, all exhausted after another day of not living but existing without hope, exhausted in daily struggle simply to not die I had to say to myself `I was wrong`.
How dare I claim to speak for those for whom I had never asked what they wanted!
ALL I COULD DO
Then I began a strange journey to do all I could while I could still remain to as asked by our tribe let the world know of the true situation in Iraq.
Carefully and with great risk, not just for me but most of all for those who told their story and opened up their homes for the camera I did my best to tape their plight as honestly and simply as I could. Whether I could get that precious tape out of the country was a different story.
What I was not prepared for was the sheer terror they felt at speaking out.
Wanting to make sure I was not simply getting the feelings of a long oppressed minority - the Assyrians - I spoke to dozens of people. What I was not prepared for was the sheer terror they felt at speaking out.
Over and over again I would be told `We would be killed for speaking like this` and finding out that they would only speak in a private home or where they were absolutely sure through the introduction of another Iraqi that I was not being attended by a minder.
From a former member of the Army to a person working with the police to taxi drivers to store owners to mothers to government officials without exception when allowed to speak freely the message was the same - `Please bring on the war. We are ready. We have suffered long enough. We may lose our lives but some of us will survive and for our children's sake please, please end our misery.
On the final day for the first time I saw the signs of war. For the first time sandbags began appearing at various government buildings but the solders putting them up and then later standing within the small circle they created gave a clear message they could not dare speak.
They hated it. They despised it. It was their job and they made clear in the way they worked to the common people watching that they were on their side and would not fight.
Near the end of my time a family member brought the word that guns had just been provided to the members of the Baath Party and for the first time we saw the small but growing signs of war.
But what of their feelings towards the United States and Britain? Those feelings are clearly mixed. They have no love for the British or the Americans but they trust them.
`We are not afraid of the American bombing. They will bomb carefully and not purposely target the people. What we are afraid of is Saddam Hussein and what he and the Baath Party will do when the war begins. But even then we want the war. It is the only way to escape our hell. Please tell them to hurry. We have been through war so many times,but this time it will give us hope`.
AT THE BORDER ... A FINAL CALL FOR HELP
The final call for help came at the most unexpected place - the border. Sadly, and sent off by the crying members of my family I left. Things were changing by the hour - the normally $100 ride from Baghdad to Amman was first $300 then $500 and by nightfall $1,000.
As we came to the border we began the routine paperwork and then the search of our vehicle. Everything was going well until suddenly the border guard asked if I had any money. We had been carefully instructed to make sure we only carried $300 when we returned so I began to open up the pouch that carried my passport and money stuffed in my shorts.
Suddenly the guard began to pat me down. `Oh, no`! I thought. It`s all over`. We had been told of what happened if you got caught with videotape, a cellular telephone or any kind of electronic equipment that had not been declared.
A trip back to Baghdad, a likely appearance before a judge, in some cases 24-48 hour holding and more.
He immediately found the first videotape stuffed in my pocket and took it out. I could see the expression of terror on the driver as he stifled a scream.
The guard shook his head as he reached into my pocket and took out another tape and then from pocket after pocket began to take out tape after tape, cellular telephone, computer camera - all the wrong things.
We all stood there in sheer terror - for a brief moment experiencing the feeling that beginning with my precious family members every Iraqi feels not for a moment but day and night, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. That terrible feeling that your life is not yours that its fate rests in someone else's hands that simply by the whim of the moment they can determine.
For one born free a terrifying feeling if but for an instant.
As the guard slowly laid out the precious video tape on the desk we all waited in silent terror for the word to be taken back to Baghdad and the beginning of the nightmare.
He didn't have to say a word. I had learned the language of the imprisoned Iraqi.
Suddenly he laid the last videotape down and looked up. His face is frozen in my memory but it was to me the look of sadness, anger and then a final look of quiet satisfaction as he clinically shook his head and quietly without a word handed all the precious videotape - the cry of those without a voice - to me.
He didn't have to say a word. I had learned the language of the imprisoned Iraqi. Forbidden to speak by sheer terror they used the one language they had left - human kindness.
As his hands slowly moved to give the tape over he said in his own way what my Uncle had said, what the taxi driver had said, what the broken old man had said, what the man in the restaurant had said, what the Army man had said, what the man working for the police had said, what the old woman had said, what the young girl had said - he said it for them in the one last message a I crossed the border from tyranny to freedom . . .
Please take these tapes and show them to the world. Please help us . . . . and please hurry!
Ken Joseph Jr. is an Assyrian, a minister and was born, raised and resides in Japan where he directs AssyrianChristians.com, the Japan Helpline and the Keikyo Institute.
By Ken Joseph, Jr.
Amman, Jordan
How do you admit you were wrong? What do you do when you realize those you were defending in fact did not want your defense and wanted something completely different from you and from the world?
This is my story. It will probably upset everybody - those with whom I have fought for peace all my life and those for whom the decision for war comes a bit too fast.
I am an Assyrian. I was born and raised in Japan where I am the second generation in ministry after my Father came to Japan in answer to General Douglas Macarthur's call for 10,000 young people to help rebuild Japan following the war.
As a minister and due to my personal convictions I have always been against war for any and all reasons. It was precisely this moral conviction that led me to do all I could to stop the current war in Iraq.
From participating in demonstrations against the war in Japan to strongly opposing it on my radio program, on television and in regular columns I did my best to stand against what I thought to be an unjust war against an innocent people - in fact my people.
As an Assyrian I was told the story of our people from a young age. How my grandparents had escaped the great Assyrian Holocaust in 1917 settling finally in Chicago.
Currently there are approximately six million Assyrians - approximately 1.2 million in Iraq and the rest scattered in the Assyrian Diaspora across the world.
Without a country and rights even in our native land it has been the prayer of generations that the Assyrian Nation will one day be restored and the people of the once great Assyrian Empire will once again be home.
HOME AT LAST
It was with that feeling, together with supplies for our Church and family that I went to Iraq to do all I could to help make a difference.
The feeling as I crossed the border was exhilarating - `home at last, I hought, as I would for the first time visit the land of my forefathers.
The kindness of the border guards when they learned I was Assyrian, the taxi, the people on the street it was like being back `home` after a long absence.
Now I finally know myself! The laid back, relaxed atmosphere, the kindness to strangers, the food, the smells, the language all seemed to trigger a long lost memory somewhere in my deepest DNA.
The first order of business was to attend Church. It was here where my morals were raked over the coals and I was first forced to examine them in the harsh light of reality.
Following a beautiful `Peace` to welcome the Peace Activists in which even the children participated, we moved to the next room to have a simple meal.
`What in the world do you mean?` I asked.
`How could you not want peace?` `We don't want peace. We want the war to come.`
Sitting next to me was an older man who carefully began to sound me out. Apparently feeling the freedom to talk in the midst of the mingling crowd he suddenly turned to me and said `There is something you should know.` `What` I asked surprised at the sudden comment.
`We didn't want to be here tonight`. he continued. `When the Priest asked us to gather for a Peace Service we said we didn't want to come`. He said.
`What do you mean` I inquired, confused. `We didn't want to come because we don't want peace` he replied.
`What in the world do you mean?` I asked. `How could you not want peace?` `We don't want peace. We want the war to come` he continued.
What in the world are you talking about? I blurted back.
That was the beginning of a strange odyssey that deeply shattered my convictions and moral base but at the same time gave me hope for my people and, in fact, hope for the world.
THE STRANGE ODYSSEY BEGINS
Beginning that night and continuing on in the private homes of relatives with whom I stayed little by little the scales began to come off my eyes.
I had not realized it but began to realize that all foreigners in Iraq are subject to 24 hour surveillance by government `minders` who arrange all interviews, visits and contact with ordinary Iraqis. Through some fluke either by my invitation as a religious person and or my family connection I was not subject to any government `minders` at any time throughout my stay in Iraq.
As far as I can tell I was the only person including the media, Human Shields and others in Iraq without a Government `minder` there to guard.
What emerged was something so awful that it is difficult even now to write about it. Discussing with the head of our tribe what I should do as I wanted to stay in Baghdad with our people during their time of trial I was told that I could most help the Assyrian cause by going out and telling the story to the outside world.
Simply put, those living in Iraq, the common, regular people are in a living nightmare. From the terror that would come across the faces of my family at a unknown visitor, telephone call, knock at the door I began to realize the horror they lived with every day.
Over and over I questioned them `Why could you want war? Why could any human being desire war?` They're answer was quiet and measured. `Look at our lives!`We are living like animals. No food, no car, no telephone, no job and most of all no hope.`
I would marvel as my family went around their daily routine as normal as could be. Baghdad was completely serene without even a hint of war. Father would get up, have his breakfast and go off to work. The children to school, the old people - ten in the household to their daily chores.
`You can not imagine what it is to live with war for 20, 30 years. We have to keep up our routine or we would lose our minds`
Then I began to see around me those seemingly in every household who had lost their minds. It seemed in every household there was one or more people who in any other society would be in a Mental Hospital and the ever present picture of a family member killed in one of the many wars.
Having been born and raised in Japan where in spite of 50 years of democracy still retains vestiges of the 400 year old police state I quickly began to catch the subtle nuances of a full blown, modern police state.
I wept with family members as I shared their pain and with great difficulty and deep soul searching began little by little to understand their desire for war to finally rid them of the nightmare they were living in.
The terrible price paid in simple, down to earth ways - the family member with a son who just screams all the time, the family member who lost his wife who left unable to cope anymore, the family member going to a daily job with nothing to do, the family member with a son lost to the war, a husband lost to alcoholism the daily, difficult to perceive slow death of people for whom all hope is lost.
The pictures of Sadaam Hussein whom people hailed in the beginning with great hope everywhere. Sadaam Hussein with his hand outstretched. Sadaam Hussein firing his rifle. Sadaam Hussein in his Arab Headdress. Sadaam Hussein in his classic 30 year old picture - one or more of these four pictures seemed to be everywhere on walls, in the middle of the road, in homes, as statues - he was everywhere!
All seeing, all knowing, all encompassing.
`Life is hell. We have no hope. But everything will be ok once the war is over.` The bizarre desire for a war that would rid them of the hopelessness was at best hard to understand.
`Look at it this way. No matter how bad it is we will not all die. We have hoped for some other way but nothing has worked. 12 years ago it went almost all the way but failed. We cannot wait anymore. We want the war and we want it now`
Coming back to family members and telling them of progress in the talks at the United Nations on working some sort of compromise with Iraq I was welcomed not with joy but anger. `No, there is no other way! We want the war! It is the only way he will get out of our lives`
Once again going back to my Japanese roots I began to understand. The stories I had heard from older Japanese of how in a strange way they had welcomed the sight of the bombers in the skies over Japan.
I had been demonstrating against the war thinking I had been doing it for the very people I was here with now and yet I had not ever bothered to ask them what they wanted.
Of course nobody wanted to be bombed but the first sight of the American B29 Bombers signaled to them that the war was coming to an end. An end was in sight. There would be terrible destruction. They might very well die but finally in a tragic way there was finally hope.
Then I began to feel so terrible. Here I had been demonstrating against the war thinking I had been doing it for the very people I was here now with and yet I had not ever bothered to ask them what they wanted. What they wanted me to do.
It was clear now what I should do. I began to talk to the so called `human shields`. Have you asked the people here what they want? Have you talked to regular people, away from your `minder` and asked them what they want?
I was shocked at the response. `We don't need to do that. We know what they want.` was the usual reply before a minder stepped up to check who I was.
With tears streaming down my face in my bed in a tiny house in Baghdad crowded in with 10 other of my own flesh and blood, all exhausted after another day of not living but existing without hope, exhausted in daily struggle simply to not die I had to say to myself `I was wrong`.
How dare I claim to speak for those for whom I had never asked what they wanted!
ALL I COULD DO
Then I began a strange journey to do all I could while I could still remain to as asked by our tribe let the world know of the true situation in Iraq.
Carefully and with great risk, not just for me but most of all for those who told their story and opened up their homes for the camera I did my best to tape their plight as honestly and simply as I could. Whether I could get that precious tape out of the country was a different story.
What I was not prepared for was the sheer terror they felt at speaking out.
Wanting to make sure I was not simply getting the feelings of a long oppressed minority - the Assyrians - I spoke to dozens of people. What I was not prepared for was the sheer terror they felt at speaking out.
Over and over again I would be told `We would be killed for speaking like this` and finding out that they would only speak in a private home or where they were absolutely sure through the introduction of another Iraqi that I was not being attended by a minder.
From a former member of the Army to a person working with the police to taxi drivers to store owners to mothers to government officials without exception when allowed to speak freely the message was the same - `Please bring on the war. We are ready. We have suffered long enough. We may lose our lives but some of us will survive and for our children's sake please, please end our misery.
On the final day for the first time I saw the signs of war. For the first time sandbags began appearing at various government buildings but the solders putting them up and then later standing within the small circle they created gave a clear message they could not dare speak.
They hated it. They despised it. It was their job and they made clear in the way they worked to the common people watching that they were on their side and would not fight.
Near the end of my time a family member brought the word that guns had just been provided to the members of the Baath Party and for the first time we saw the small but growing signs of war.
But what of their feelings towards the United States and Britain? Those feelings are clearly mixed. They have no love for the British or the Americans but they trust them.
`We are not afraid of the American bombing. They will bomb carefully and not purposely target the people. What we are afraid of is Saddam Hussein and what he and the Baath Party will do when the war begins. But even then we want the war. It is the only way to escape our hell. Please tell them to hurry. We have been through war so many times,but this time it will give us hope`.
AT THE BORDER ... A FINAL CALL FOR HELP
The final call for help came at the most unexpected place - the border. Sadly, and sent off by the crying members of my family I left. Things were changing by the hour - the normally $100 ride from Baghdad to Amman was first $300 then $500 and by nightfall $1,000.
As we came to the border we began the routine paperwork and then the search of our vehicle. Everything was going well until suddenly the border guard asked if I had any money. We had been carefully instructed to make sure we only carried $300 when we returned so I began to open up the pouch that carried my passport and money stuffed in my shorts.
Suddenly the guard began to pat me down. `Oh, no`! I thought. It`s all over`. We had been told of what happened if you got caught with videotape, a cellular telephone or any kind of electronic equipment that had not been declared.
A trip back to Baghdad, a likely appearance before a judge, in some cases 24-48 hour holding and more.
He immediately found the first videotape stuffed in my pocket and took it out. I could see the expression of terror on the driver as he stifled a scream.
The guard shook his head as he reached into my pocket and took out another tape and then from pocket after pocket began to take out tape after tape, cellular telephone, computer camera - all the wrong things.
We all stood there in sheer terror - for a brief moment experiencing the feeling that beginning with my precious family members every Iraqi feels not for a moment but day and night, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. That terrible feeling that your life is not yours that its fate rests in someone else's hands that simply by the whim of the moment they can determine.
For one born free a terrifying feeling if but for an instant.
As the guard slowly laid out the precious video tape on the desk we all waited in silent terror for the word to be taken back to Baghdad and the beginning of the nightmare.
He didn't have to say a word. I had learned the language of the imprisoned Iraqi.
Suddenly he laid the last videotape down and looked up. His face is frozen in my memory but it was to me the look of sadness, anger and then a final look of quiet satisfaction as he clinically shook his head and quietly without a word handed all the precious videotape - the cry of those without a voice - to me.
He didn't have to say a word. I had learned the language of the imprisoned Iraqi. Forbidden to speak by sheer terror they used the one language they had left - human kindness.
As his hands slowly moved to give the tape over he said in his own way what my Uncle had said, what the taxi driver had said, what the broken old man had said, what the man in the restaurant had said, what the Army man had said, what the man working for the police had said, what the old woman had said, what the young girl had said - he said it for them in the one last message a I crossed the border from tyranny to freedom . . .
Please take these tapes and show them to the world. Please help us . . . . and please hurry!
Ken Joseph Jr. is an Assyrian, a minister and was born, raised and resides in Japan where he directs AssyrianChristians.com, the Japan Helpline and the Keikyo Institute.
Ken Joseph Jnr
Comments
Hide the following 13 comments
read this
31.03.2003 13:17
weblog of a guy living in baghdad...*nobody* he knows wants the war, as he says, they're not suicidal
as for those people having no job or food etc.... despite the ba'ath's regime's brutality, before the first gulf war they had the most comprehensive healthcare and welfare system in the arab world...12 yrs on it's a 3rd world country thanx to sanctions
hk
Who is he working for?
31.03.2003 13:22
Keikyo.com is sponsored by the non-profit Keikyo Institute, founded in 1951 to study and cover the history of Eastern Christianity in Asia. Keikyo is the Japanese word for the Luminous Religion, attached to the early form of Eastern Christianity that arrived in Japan in the fifth century. Includes Japanese Christian periodicals, businesses, websites and organizations.
Kids Around World
Illustrate Peace, Democracy and Social Issues in International Collaborative Program
Students in countries around the world are joining together in a ground-breaking global, collaborative project focused on diplomacy and global issues, creating unique works of art, with thirty-two of the top ranked entries to be reproduced into eight collaborative glass tile mosaics.
We encourage all Assyrian young people to join this project!
Links to here:
This program is sponsored by...
US Department of State (!)
The site:
is sponsored by NetV, which also hosts the site for:
So basically this looks like another one of those US think-tank creations to push a pro-war stance under the guise of an independent "charitable" organisation...
no-war
Eh?!?!
31.03.2003 13:44
Michael
I wonder why they are fighting so hard...
31.03.2003 14:24
Anyone can write a passionate account of "conversion" to the pro-war cause after a meeting with some (probably ficticious) Iraqi people.
If this is the true attitude of anything other than a tiny minority of the Iraqi people, why the hell are they fighting us "liberators" so hard?
Face it - no matter who is ruling you country you will defend it from foreign invaders. Especially invaders who have been starving your entire nation for over 10 years, killing over 1/2 million children.
Dannyboy
article on Assyrian Christians and the war
31.03.2003 14:43
Arab Christians
By Kevin Filan
During the Middle Ages the Crusaders hoped that the armies of Prestor John, ruler of a mighty Christian empire, would come from the East and sweep the Moslem infidels from the Holy Land. Unfortunately, the Assyrian Christians ruled no such empire; rather, they were a beleagured minority within their own lands. Their situation has not improved today, as 1 million Iraqi Christians find themselves under the thumb of one of the world's most brutal dictatorships. The Assyrian Christians have frequently found themselves victimized by emperors professing various faiths, and still have maintained their culture and their religion despite all odds. In a region filled with bloody history, the history of the Assyrian Church is among the bloodiest … and the proudest.
The Assyrians were among the first people to convert to Christianity, and among the first to send out missionaries. Assyrian churches dating to the 1st century have been discovered in China, while in the 5th century Assyrian Orthodox clergymen could be found throughout India. Marco Polo, writing in the late 13th century, recorded that of the six kings to be found in the heart of India, the greatest was an Assyrian Christian. Unfortunately, they soon found themselves caught up in the political strife which accompanied Christianity's rise as a world religion. First they were persecuted by the Magians, the Persian priests who ruled the area. Those regions which fell under the control of the Roman Empire fared little better, as Christians in the province of Assyria shared the fate of their coreligionists in the empire. In 448 150,000 Assyrian Christians were killed by the Persian emperor in the region of modern-day Kirkuk; a local legend attributes the red color of the gravel to the blood which was spilled there.
The coming of the Arabs made the Assyrian Christians second-class citizens in their homeland. Subject to heavy taxation and constant oppression, some converted to Islam. Others retained their faith, even at the cost of their lives. As the Islamic Empire found itself in constant conflict with the Christian kingdoms on its borders, its Christian subjects found themselves under constant suspicion. Theological and cultural differences had led to the Assyrians being declared heretics by the Byzantine and Roman churches, while the Moslems considered them potential spies. The persecution did not decrease over time; in 1842 Kurdish leader Badr Khan Bey set out to eliminate the Assyrian Christians from the mountains, and succeeded in killing thousands and sending thousands more into slavery. In 1932 the British withdrew from the region, neglecting their promised support for the Assyrian minority which had supported them . The Iraqi government soon thereafter massacred thousands of Assyrian Christians in an orgy of bloodshed, rape and looting which destroyed entire villages.
Today the Assyrian Christians are officially "protected" by Sadaam Hussein's secular Baath party. High-ranking Iraqi officials, most notably Deputy Prime Minister Tariq Aziz, are of Assyrian ancestry, and Christian churches can be found throughout the country, particularly in Mosul (known in Biblical times as Nineveh). This does not mean that the persecution has stopped. Under Hussein's program of "Arabization," expressions of Assyrian culture are frowned upon and Assyrians are viewed as "Arab Christians" - while among the Kurdish people they are frequently called "Christian Kurds" and occasionally "filthy infidels." There have been sporadic flare-ups of anti-Assyrian and anti-Christian violence in the Kurdish autonomous zones of northern Iraq, despite the fact that Assyrians have fought alongside Kurds in the various Kurdish militias, and despite the fact that Assyrians were murdered alongside Kurds in Hussein's genocidal "Anfal" program. Once again the Assyrians find themselves between a rock and a hard place. If they support Hussein, they face retaliation from Kurdish terrorists: if they support the Kurds, they become a prime target for the Iraqi war machine.
Should the U.S. and Iraq go to war, the Assyrians have little to gain… and much to lose. Iraq is essentially an artificial entity, a Yugoslavia-like entity consisting of several linguistic, cultural and ethnic groups. The Shi'ite majority has long felt oppressed by the Sunnis who make up a disproportionate part of the Ba'ath Party… and the Kurds, who have long sought their own homeland, have now begun gravitating toward militant Islam. In a crisis, all these groups might unite in their hatred and mistrust of the Christian minority … and the end result could be yet another anti-Assyrian genocide.
kurious oranj
This story reeks of US propaganda
31.03.2003 14:52
For information on his dad, Rev. Kenny Joseph Snr, see:
Joseph Snr was born in Chicago and went to Japan to do evangelical work (converting "Godless" Buddhists) in 1951. He ran the "World Christian Anti-Communism Assn" in the 1960s and he is involved with the Moody Bible Institute at Bob Jones University, a notoriously right-wing institution that was WHITES ONLY until 1971 and STILL bans interracial dating on campus!:
When the Yanks have colonised Iraq, these God-botherers will no doubt be in there trying to turn "Godless" Muslims into all-American Christians.
Dave
e-mail:
dst@canterbury.u-net.com
Is it Bullshit?
31.03.2003 14:56
Perhaps you should read the original post again and read what the dude said about his judgement being clouded. Or what you could do is just pass everyhting you don't agree with as bullshit.. in fact why doesn't everyone just do that.. there we go.. lets all breed ignorance for the sake of our own personal beliefs.. i'm sure the world will be a better place
Michael
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31.03.2003 15:20
What we do know is that the Iraq assaults on the Kurds occurred because THREE TIMES the U.S. encouraged the Kurds to rebel (a bit like Russia persuading Ohio to take up arms against the government) before abandoning them to their bloody fate. What we do know is that the U.S. fermented the Iran/Iraq war and during this war militarily backed Iraq whilst covertly arming Iran. Pointdexter is now back in government too.
What we do know is that the U.S. Chemical Weapons (Agent Orange to be precise) has kill over 500,000 Vietnamese civilians and as we speak is killing a further million. What we do know is that the glorious U.S. has bombed 30 countries since WWII and toppled 40 democracies. What we do know is that around the world the CIA has been directly implicated in 'regime change' and the massacre of democratic activists thereafter. Take a look at the Northwoods documents as an example. You can get them from the U.S. government archives.
What we do know is that "Gulf Invasion II" isn't to do with AlQuida. The only people out there using WMD are the Americans. And 'freedom for the Iraqi people?' is a fucking joke. Freedom like the other U.S. puppet States that litter the world. Freedom like in Kuwait? Freedom like in Panama when two months before Saddam (after famously receiving the green-light from the U.S. ambassador) invaded Kuwait General Noriega (a U.S. imposed dictator) stopped taking orders resulting in an identical (to the Iraqis) invasion of Panama with the slaughter of 3000 civilians...
If America is a democracy and is therefore accountable to its people, it is then a FASCIST nation. Its military seeks full spectrum dominance, its strategic planners seek empire. Its leaders seemk perpetual war to hoist perpetual fear and paranoia upon its people, to goad them into doing their bidding.
After the WTC attacks the logical step would have been to ask : Who are these Al-Quida? Ah... They're U.S. trained terrorists. Who trained them and why? Ah... the military right-wing seeking glory in the Middle East at the expense of its people, at the expense of Justice and at the expense of Democracy (which was actually credible under the Russinas, it wasn't under the Taliban - thanks U.S.A.).
Lets get rid of the U.S. Right Wing.
You muppet.
__
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31.03.2003 15:20
What we do know is that the Iraq assaults on the Kurds occurred because THREE TIMES the U.S. encouraged the Kurds to rebel (a bit like Russia persuading Ohio to take up arms against the government) before abandoning them to their bloody fate. What we do know is that the U.S. fermented the Iran/Iraq war and during this war militarily backed Iraq whilst covertly arming Iran. Pointdexter is now back in government too.
What we do know is that the U.S. Chemical Weapons (Agent Orange to be precise) has kill over 500,000 Vietnamese civilians and as we speak is killing a further million. What we do know is that the glorious U.S. has bombed 30 countries since WWII and toppled 40 democracies. What we do know is that around the world the CIA has been directly implicated in 'regime change' and the massacre of democratic activists thereafter. Take a look at the Northwoods documents as an example. You can get them from the U.S. government archives.
What we do know is that "Gulf Invasion II" isn't to do with AlQuida. The only people out there using WMD are the Americans. And 'freedom for the Iraqi people?' is a fucking joke. Freedom like the other U.S. puppet States that litter the world. Freedom like in Kuwait? Freedom like in Panama when two months before Saddam (after famously receiving the green-light from the U.S. ambassador) invaded Kuwait General Noriega (a U.S. imposed dictator) stopped taking orders resulting in an identical (to the Iraqis) invasion of Panama with the slaughter of 3000 civilians...
If America is a democracy and is therefore accountable to its people, it is then a FASCIST nation. Its military seeks full spectrum dominance, its strategic planners seek empire. Its leaders seemk perpetual war to hoist perpetual fear and paranoia upon its people, to goad them into doing their bidding.
After the WTC attacks the logical step would have been to ask : Who are these Al-Quida? Ah... They're U.S. trained terrorists. Who trained them and why? Ah... the military right-wing seeking glory in the Middle East at the expense of its people, at the expense of Justice and at the expense of Democracy (which was actually credible under the Russinas, it wasn't under the Taliban - thanks U.S.A.).
Lets get rid of the U.S. Right Wing.
You muppet.
__
Fascist not muppet....please
31.03.2003 15:56
Michael
c'mon guys
31.03.2003 22:27
and a few of you seem to have just a little bit of anger stored up against those christians. jsut because a few of them ARE right wing faicists surely you're not so naive as to think that all of them are. would you put anti muslim posts on this websites and call them offensivwe names as you have done to christians, like calling them god botherers ( or more to the point would you be allowed to?) just because a few of them are religious fanatics? isn't that what you're against the right wing us government doing? aren't a christians values as err... valuable ( can't think of a better word!) as everyone elses?
i thought that's what we've gotta believe in our ultra politically correct, post modern world.
raa few of you seem tchy
c'mon guys
31.03.2003 22:35
and a few of you seem to have just a little bit of anger stored up against those christians. jsut because a few of them ARE right wing faicists surely you're not so naive as to think that all of them are. would you put anti muslim posts on this websites and call them offensivwe names as you have done to christians, like calling them god botherers ( or more to the point would you be allowed to?) just because a few of them are religious fanatics? isn't that what you're against the right wing us government doing? aren't a christians values as err... valuable ( can't think of a better word!) as everyone elses?
i thought that's what we've gotta believe in our ultra politically correct, post modern world.
raa few of you seem tchy
anti-Christian?
02.04.2003 15:32
kurious oranj