Marching Thru London won't stop war nor influence leaders

'C' | 31.01.2003 02:32

Ordinary People have the power to stop war in Iraq, but not by having a march through London every month, that will not change anything

It looks like war against Iraq is inevitable; the people in power in the US will get their way one way or another. Ordinary People have the power to stop this war, but not by having a march through London every month, that will not change anything. Peaceful resistance was tried in the 60’s, it may have had a major part in stopping the Vietnam War, but after the war ended the peace movement stagnated. Nowadays the people in power will have learnt how to ‘deal’ with ‘peace movements’ – they don’t have problems letting people march through a city once in a while because they know it won’t disrupt their agenda. Direct Action - the two words that strike fear into the hearts of the rulers and the power-owners. Only Direct Action can stop this war, it is not enough to get out onto the streets and march, we need to get out on the streets and show them that we mean business, it’s time to fuck with their agenda directly, it’s time to deal with the fundamental causes of the war – Capitalism and State!

'C'
Homepage: http://members.fortunecity.com/directaction/flh/

Comments

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Finally someone talking sense !

31.01.2003 05:02

Finally someone talking sense !

thevoiceofjustice

Hurrah for direct action!

31.01.2003 09:47

...and let's do it. Good turn out at Northwood, where over 70 people got arrested for blockading the base. Even better fun at Fairford, where an estimate 1500 people turned up to inspect the weapons and several dozens made their way into the base, cutting or claimbing a very vulnerable fence - though the police made only 3 arrests, maybe to avoid publicity, maybe to hide their own incompetence. There are talks to set up a peace camp at Fairford. While a peace camp is being set up at Colchester, from the 2nd to the 5th of February, with the intent to try and stop British troops leaving towards Iraq. Who is up for that? I'm sorry if I'm boring somebody who already knows it all about these actions, but there are lots of people who don't know. The 4th of February is Day of Action against the oil companies, who are the main responsible for this war: shut down your local petrol station!!!
Reclaim the Future 2003 (Sat 1 February- tomorrow!)is an anti war and anti capitalist event, with anti-war meeting from 3pm, video ecc.
One thing I dearly miss is a space where activists can meet and plot in peace and tranquillity, without having to book a room in advance and so on- an anti-war socil centre if you want, with ongoing discussion and strategy building, in view of the 15th of February but not only-there are things going on all the time and I hope there will be more aned more. The 15th is important because there will be lots of peaple in the streets, hope everybody has clear ideas of what to do on that day because I haven't, at least not at the moment, which is a shame because it looks like a terrific occasion for getting people involved in something better then marching from A to B.
Another good thing to do is writing on the walls, I'd like to see the city covered in anti-war graffiti.

kat

One million people in London on February 15..

31.01.2003 10:55

will make all the difference. Marches like this politicize new people, and get them ready to (a) vote against New Labour or (b) take direct action.

EzyPzy

Moral High Ground

31.01.2003 11:05

If you are not for the 'war on terror' then you are against it - and so by definition, a 'terrorist sympathiser' and new legislation is waiting to jail "rioters" (provoked by police) for up to ten years, or forever, if you are foreign...

But, if you are not for us, (the peace movement) you are against us!

Better to starve free, than die a fat slave.

Chick

Mass sitdown protest at Piccadilly Circus

31.01.2003 11:25

There will be a mass sit down protest at Piccadilly Circus. At 5pm on Saturday the 15th of February organised by ARROW active resistance to the roots of war. People are being asked to assemble in Green Park at 5pm and then we will all walk to Piccadilly Circus for the sit down protest. This will be a chance for mass civil disobedience!

Please spread word of this event far and wide and post it on as many website message boards as possible!

Harlequin
Homepage: http://www.j-n-v.org/

not one or the other

31.01.2003 11:51

it is far too simplistic to put 'direct action' against marching - of course we need direct action - but on a mass scale ie. general strikes, mass occupations, civil disobedience etc.....the direct action which is continually posed on this site as 'better' than marching is the act of a minority which whilst I support will not stop the war anymore than a single march -

we are living in times of real possiblity not the 80's/90's when only a limited amount of action was possible - the point about the 15 demo (which actually could make a huge difference in splitting the UK from the US (labour is literally tearing itself apart behind the scenes over all this) is that if it is HUGE not only will it give a massive confidence boost to everyone there, but they will then go back to where they work go to school etc...and be more confident about being able to try and persuade people that we can strike etc...against the war and that is REALLY the kind of direct action that will stop our government. Plus of course if it is huge there is no reason why 10,000's of people will not want to participate in sit-ins or whatever on the day.

good sense

YAAAAWNNN

31.01.2003 11:55

Mr (Miss??) "C", Funny how your website has so many Pop-Up ads...isn't that sort of "capitalist"...anyways good for you.
"Direct Action"...so you think those words strike fear to the hearts of the "people in power"..I suppose it is good to have dreams. Do you honestly think that they would care even if you sat down on Piccadily Circus for a whole week?? And even if you would start a riot and trash half of Central London, do you think this would change their mind??

I can just see it, Tony calling George: "Yeah, George they're running on the streets here and breaking windows.We can't go to war ..."
George saying "Oh, I am sorry Tony, I didn't know the people there don't agree with the war. Lets call our troops home and stop this silly war."

Unfortunately it doesn;'t matter to the U.S government, what we do here in the rest of the world. When George says it's war...he's little mind can';t change it. He'll have his war...alone or with the UN backing.

Darren

Re: YAAAWN

31.01.2003 12:15

Your's is one theory and it could well be right, but suppose it isn't? At least we're going to try. See you all on the 15th.

Mark
mail e-mail: mark@hardcorecarvers.co.uk
Homepage: www.hardcorecarvers.co.uk

Too right, marches alone won't do a thing

31.01.2003 12:38

The SWP/STWC march may attract a small amount of publicity, but in the end will not stop Bush and Blair's war on Iraq. You only have to see what effect the STWC had on stopping the Afghan campaign, (i.e. none at all), to realise that it is going to take more than parading through the streets of London waving nice little placards to put an end to this barbaric war.

It's direct action, where people are actually challenging the system that makes this war possible, which will send a message to the government that we will not tolerate any more bloodshed in our name, and we will do whatever it takes to stop them.

Thomas J

What does 'C' stand for? CIA?

31.01.2003 15:17

Isn't all this defeatist shit a little bit suspicious? Doesn't it have the whiff of the Spook/Agent Provocateur about it? I mean if you would rather be some masturbatory splinter group that's up to you, but why slag off 500,000 people marching for peace.

Unless you want the only coverage of the peace movement to be the usual photo of three crusties smashing a window accompanied by the usual "look-at-these-scum-they-speak-for-no-one" crap from the right wing press.

Watching Fight Club once does not make you an expert on leading a successful revolution, buddy. Use your loaf.

Am I the only person (don't worry, its pure rhetoric, I know I'm not) who thinks that we, the peace movement, can have BOTH a 500,000 strong march AND a series of direct action protests?

Does the charmingly impractical 'C' think that all the fluffy old 65-year-old CND vets and ordinary members of the public who have never been on a demo before are going to transform themselves into black flag waving anarchs just 'cos a few people are buzzing bricks at the nearest Starbucks?

No. They won't. They'll be turned off and we'll have lost the best chance for a decade to politicise a large swathe of our citizenry.

Get a grip and a more practical outlook: Serious political campaigning and agitating requires action on a number of fronts; the 'usual channels' (letters to press, MPs, photo-opps etc), mass demonstrations and campaigns (good for building membership, showing the breadth of opposition etc) and direct action (good for showing the Powers that Be that we're not all Guardian readers and we're not to be messed with).

Every form of protest is valid, apart from terrorism, state-inspired or otherwise. Where do people get off dissing the sort of people who can get half a million people in London.

Now bog off.

Mad Monk

yeah!

31.01.2003 16:22

What Monk just said. Spot on. :-)

kurious oranj

To Monk

31.01.2003 18:29

Monk, i was slighty offended by what you said in your last post, it had all the markings of a petulent spiolt brat.
What i was trying to say was that marching through london will not change anything - the war is still going ahead, sorry to say it - but thats what it boils down to.
We need to take a more widespread radical approach to the situation, coz lets face it - a bunch of mainly middle-class people and students marching about london will not change dick all.This 'anti-war or whateva you call it movement'. This 'movement' (dunno weva i should call it that) needs more of the average working person involved ( like me - heh heh), i talk to people about the situation and try and change their mindframe - y'see most people i come accross think we are at real risk of getting attacked by saddam, thus back a war, i try to talk to them about how the US gave him WMD in the first place.etcetc... but 7 times out of 10 that doesn't alter their position - this is why i think we need a more radical approach to thinks and need to communicate with a wider audience.
DIRECT ACTION -right here right now

'C'
Homepage: http://members.fortunecity.com/directaction/flh

All is Good

31.01.2003 19:27

First thing, stop dissing the police wholesale. What good will it do? Only reinforce those who are pro-violence, and undermine those (yes, there are many) who aren't. Support the decent ones, for heaven's sake. They may be part of "the system" but so are you; yes, even (especially) if you're signing on & not working in it.

Secondly, everyone's got a part to play in this. EIGHTY FOUR PERCENT of the public are against this war (latest poll). Whatever you do, you're representing them. Stop trying to draw simplistic class/political lines. Appreciate diversity. Renounce aggression (and there's a lot of it right now on the newswire) yourselves. From what I'm reading I'd trust less than half of you with a nuke. Just like George Bush, you'd set it on someone you've got a gripe against, never mind your "peace" talk.

fed up

Trust

31.01.2003 22:14

"...I'd trust less than half of you with a nuke."

I wouldn't trust Gandhi with a nuke - even if he's dead.

Disillusioned kid

what it boils down to.

01.02.2003 02:25

i have seen too many people misled and let down by the system. i see people who lead lives in ignorance - also i see people being killed by bombs and people being killed by thoughtless repressive governments ,. basically i see shit in this world , and one of my 'basics' is to rise up against that 'shit'. thats it my fiends
fight the power harnessers or they'll come for you
direct action now
thanks for your time 'C'

'C'
Homepage: http://members.fortunecity.com/directaction/flh/

Only slightly offended?

02.02.2003 13:35

VERY disappointed that you were only 'slightly' offended by my demolition of your pathetic pseudo "working-class hero" posturing, 'C'.

I was hoping you'd have some kind of seizure.

And where have you gained the necessary psychological insight to declare me a "petulant spoilt brat" (its OK, I've corrected your spelling)?

The only petulance I detect in the anti-war movement (Yes it is a movement 'C', that's 'cos things are moving, with 84 per cent of people - - against the war) is from people like you, chucking their toys out the pram because not everyone wants to play their game, 'snot fair.

Spoilt? Moi? Dunno where you got that idea mate, my life has been a heart-rending tale of deprivation and poverty, honest.

Don't make the mistake of thinking I'm posh just 'cos I know how to write and spell, chum.

You don't HAVE to be middle class to do well at school, you know.

Mad Monk

A higher cause

03.02.2003 15:33

This is all getting out of hand the bottom line is we want peace. Arguing over ideology and beliefs has no place at the moment. The stw, swp do an amazing job of organising and getting together rediculous amounts of people to protest. If they are going to shy away from NVDA then so be it, the work they are doing for the movement is great. as advocates of NVDA we must now take them as an example and organise huge direct action. the autonomous groups around the country should start to work together and unite for peace leaving ideology at home. If we could arange 500 000 people to go to london and paint picadilly circus with red paint that would be great. we need to strive forward with one main aim.
civildisobedience for peace

kris