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Why do the Europeans support the Palestinians

Dov | 21.05.2002 12:56

Why do the Europeans support the Palestinians

Whose the instigators of terror.
The "cycle" in practice works like this: Palestinian terrorists conduct random, murderous attacks targeting Israeli civilian populations in public buses, shopping malls, cafe's disco's, sbarro's pizzeria's, Bar Mitzvah's, shoe stores, schools and restaurants. The Palestinians goal is to massacre as many Israeli civilians as possible. The Israeli military pursues strikes against military or terrorist targets in response, attempting to disable terrorist networks that Arafat won't stop himself, since he is no different from them.

In the one case, Palestinian terrorists set out to murder as many Israeli civilians as possible. Israel responds to these terrorists acts, by targeting Palestinian terrorists who sponsor these murderous acts against Israeli civilians. The Palestinians then hide these terrorists in civilian areas, wanting Israel to fire back, so civilians are killed, so this looks good on TV.

The attempt to draw a moral equivalence between the Palestinians' deliberate attempts to kill innocents and inspire terror and Israel's military responses to these attacks is not far different from describing the U.S. airstrikes on Afghanistan as "perpetuating the cycle of violence between al Qaeda and the United States."

Terrorism is the DELIBERATE targeting of innocent civilians and noncombatants for political or religious purposes.

Pretty simple!

The Palestinians are terrorists because they deliberately target innocent Israeli men, women and children going about their daily lifes

The Israelis do not deliberately target Palestinian civilians/non combatants. Israelis Defence Forces only target Palestinian terrorists who are engaged in the execution and commissioning of terrorist acts. The IDF goes to amazing lengths to reduce Palestinian "collateral damage" but this is often hampered by the terrorists usage of civilian human shields.

The poverty of such comparisons was made painfully clear last week by a statement from Ahmed Abdel Rahman, secretary of the Palestinian cabinet, who blamed a recent Israeli raid on a Palestinian bomb factory in Nablus for the current spate of attacks. If one side is making the bombs ( destined to be strapped to suicidal terrorists to massacre Israeli civilians) and the other side conducting raids to prevent their manufacture, there is little room to question who is in the right. Is it any wonder, why Palestinians find moral equivalence, between Palestinian terrorists who blow up Sbarros pizzeria's and discos filled with teenagers and Israeli commandos, who preemptively kill terrorist ringleaders, before they send their suicide bombers into Israel on a mission to kill Jewish civilians.

Dov

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Film

21.05.2002 13:26

PIERRE REHOV, a French producer who produced The Trojan Horse. " Its a French-produced Mideast documentary, that contains footage of Arab leaders calling for the extermination of the Israeli people. Through exclusive footage of Palestinian leaders themselves -- including Yasser Arafat -- that their goal remains the eradication of the Jewish state. See video's of Arafat calling for jihad and the total destruction of Israel. See Arafat's spokesman explain the peace process is merely a first step toward the destruction of Israel. See Arafat's officials say the Holocaust was a hoax. See the indoctrination of young Palestinian boys being told, when you become a suicide bomber and murder Jews you will go to heaven and be with 72 virgins. You will also see interviews with Israeli families whose children were massacred by Palestinian homicide bombers in disco's, pizzeria's, buses, shopping malls and cafe's. The film feature exclusive footage taken from Arab media showing the hatred being indoctrinated into the Arab world through the schools and mosques  http://www.shopnetdaily.com/store/item.asp?ITEM_ID=380

Pierre


Why do they deliberately kill kids

21.05.2002 13:33

TEL AVIV (Dec 15) - 6 months after the terrorist attack at the Dolphinarium complex in Tel Aviv, hundreds gathered next to the site of the suicide bombing, where a monument was dedicated in memory of the 21 victims.

Those in attendance included families and friends of the deceased, youths wounded in the attack, politicians, and diplomats.

"A Palestinian Genocidal suicide bomber chose to murder as many innocent teenagers as possible. The Jews he butchered, wanted to live and play and dance.
Here, in front of the sea's waves, their lives ended," said Tel Aviv Mayor Ron Huldai. To the families, Huldai added: "We go home, but you return home where there is someone missing."

Finance Minister Silvan Shalom said, we must stand up to the Palestinians angels of death. Silvan Shalom went on to say, the Israeli left must stop appeasing the butchers of our teenagers.

Internal Security Minister Uzi Landau said, The barbarity of the Tel Aviv disco bombing, was a murderous act that reminds all Israelis, the evil we are dealing with. The Palestinians by targeting youngsters. The Palestinians set a new low for ruthless cruelty. Between the speeches, young friends of the victims spoke and sang about their losses. "All that is left now is a terrible, shocking stillness.

There is no more laughter and nowhere to go," one friend sang to the audience. A young violinist played a well-known song, "I Have Friends," and many audience members began to cry as the names of the victims wereread following the piece. Sergei Bogoliubov, who laid a wreath for his friend, Yelena Osache, sat with his friends next to the stage. "It has been very hard for us," he said.

While friends, families, and dignitaries laid wreaths, many young people gathered next to the discotheque entrance, where the explosion occurred. Yulia Bilzer, a friend of one of the victims, said: "This month feels very long. We have spent the time visiting our wounded friends in the hospitals." Several of the wounded youth came to the ceremony. One young girl, wearing a neck brace, screamed! Why do Arabs slaughter teenagers and children. Why Why!. This was 20th visit to the site of the attack.

Amos


They are evil

21.05.2002 13:36

Another article for you.
Night & day; tears by Binny Freedman Friday, August 10, 2001

Yesterday; Thursday, August 9th the 20th of Av, on my way to work, I found myself walking down Yaffo street. Hungry, I decided to stop and grab a quick bite at Sbarro's Pizza.

In the past 5 years I have frequented this establishment exactly twice. Walking into Sbarro's there is a larger area for sitting in the front, but the back looked a bit cooler and quieter, so I decided to grab a seat in the back.
That decision saved my life.

Waiting on line, when they brought me the baked Zitti I asked for, it was cold. So I asked the woman behind the counter if she'd mind warming it up. "Ein Ba'ayah", no problem, she said with a smile. I will always wonder if that was her last smile on earth...

At about 2PM, I both felt & heard a tremendous explosion, and day turned into night. And then the screaming began. An awful, heartrending sound; the sound of people coming to terms with a whole new reality, of people not wanting to comprehend that life has changed forever.

Those of us sitting in the back were spared, but I was afraid of panic, so I started yelling at everyone to quieten down; not to panic. The ceiling looked like it might cave in, but there is always the danger of a second explosion, detonated on purpose shortly after the first.

But then I smelled smoke, and was suddenly afraid the restaurant might be on foire. So we started climbing our way through the wreckage to the front.

Would there be another explosion? Would the roof collapse? Were we making the wrong decision, climbing through? There are momenmts that last a lifetime.

There are no words to describe what the front of Sbarro's Pizza looked like in the immediate aftermath of that explosion.

A woman was lying near the steps to the back. Her eyes were staring straight at me, following me. So full of pain and longing, sadness and despair. I dropped down becide her trying to ellicit a response to see if she could speak. And
then I watched the life just drain out of her. I tried to get a pulse, to no availability. She died there, on the steps in front of me. She was lying by the table I had decided not to sit at. Her eyes, I think, will stay with me
forever. Imploring, beseeching, full of so much sadness. I think the shock of where and how she was, was sinking in. I can't begin to describe all that was in those eyes.

There were bodies everywhere, and those images are in my mind; they won't let go. A child's body under the wreckage; a baby-carriage; limbs and a torso. A woman holding a motor-cycle helmet and screaming next to a person on the floor
who had obviously been someone she was with.

And then the mad rush to help the ambulance and emergency crews get the wounded out. They were obviously afraid of a second bomb, so there was no medical effort inside beyond getting the wounded on to stretchers and out. A religious
Jew missing at least two Arms in tears and shock; what do you say? "yehiyeh Be'Seder" it'll be all right? Will it?

I happened to sit a bit to the left as you walk towards the back, and so the wall behind me shielded me from the blast. Another fellow whom we went back in to get wasn't so lucky. Sitting only 5 or 6 feet to my left, he caught the full
force of the blast and was thrown in the air. When we got him on the stretcher he was bleeding profusely and was missing a leg. There are no words to describe what that man's hand, clenched around my arm, felt like. He just kept looking from me to his leg and back again. I started saying Tehillim (psalms).

So many mixed emotions fill my head today. I came home last night and gave each of my children a very long hug. But there are so many families today who are waking up to the reality that life will never be the same. 15 funerals with
friends and families saying goodbye to those they loved so, whose only crime was a desire for a slice of Pizza on a beautiful Jerusalem afternoon. What shocked me most, was seeing on TV, the Palestinians all over the West Bank,
celebrating and dancing when they heard of the massacre. What kind of people, celebrate seeing innocent civilians and children slaughtered.

David


Its all so clear now

21.05.2002 13:40

You seem to have missed the bit about the military occupation of another state, and the continuing repression of Palestine. If Israel wasn't annexing and colonising, I imagine the problem would soon be solved. Nice attempt at propaganda though.

Nick


Palestinian butchers

21.05.2002 13:41

A Witness to the scene. by Dale Rapoportbridges of
peace, Thur Aug 9 01
It was approximately 6:30 PM in the evening, when
I decided to finish off a visit to downtown Jerusalem by stopping for a quick meal at Sbarro Italian Restaurant, as I almost always do, when I go to downtown Jerusalem. As I approached Sbarro Italian Restaurant, I heard and then saw a loud crowd around the intersection of King George
Street and Jaffa Street. I heard this loud explosion.
"There were baby carriages everywhere and mothers were running around in terror, looking for their babies under the collapsed ceiling. " Television news crews arrived on scene 10 minutes after the terrorist attack on the Sbarro Italian Restaurantin downtown Jerusalem. Rabbis and volunteers from "Zaka," a Jewish Funeral Society were diligently collecting the remains of the deceased in order to prepare their remains for a proper Jewish burial. It was one of the most horrible things i have ever seen. Mothers
who saw there babies split in half with no arms or legs. I saw people laying on the ground, screaming for help. I kept saying to myself, why do Arabs target civilians? Why do they massacre babies? Why is Jimmy Carter silent on this latest Arab Atrocity. The fact is, the Arabs specifically
target and murder babies, Woman and Children.
They are not Humans. They are evil

Amos


Naomi Ragen

21.05.2002 13:48

Good Article by Naomi Ragan about Netanya, Passover massacre, by some by one who was actually there.

Netanya, Israel 2002, By Naomi Ragen, 29 people were exterminated by a Palestinian Nazi terrorist. Some of the people slaughtered, had survived the worst maniacs of the century, Hitler, Stalin, and now Arafat. People who had lost their families and rebuilt; had been refugees and resettled. And yet, despite all the evil that they had witnessed, had remained the kindest, most generous and gentle of human beings; people without hatred, who loved life and other human beings. And I thought: Nothing had changed since Hitler. For all the Holocaust Museums, and lectures, and lip-service, people were still trying to kill them and theirs simply because they were Jews. Only by an act of God, had they failed, the way Hitler failed before them. I thought of the reporters who had spent the past eighteen months filling the airwaves and print columns with learned and sympathetic analyses of the Palestinian cause and its unfortunate, but understandable by- product—according to CNN and BBC and NPR and many, many others-- Moslem suicide bombers.

Mike Hanna of CNN, Sam Kiley of the Times of London, and Suzanne Goldenberg of the Guardian, who actually got an award for her sympathetic, tear- stained articles on suicide-bomber museums set up in Arafat-land to honor "shahids," and for her understanding, compassionate interviews with their mothers and uncles and cousins…. All of these people, and so many, many others in the media and in Foreign Ministries all over the world had conspired to make sure Abed Al-Basat Odeh of Tul Karem, a Hamas terrorist on the most wanted list given to Yasir Arafat's so-called security forces more than a year ago, would have nothing to fear.

With their help, neither he, nor the Palestinian cause he espoused, would suffer should he succeed in killing me and my family as we gathered around the Seder table to observe the most sacred of Jewish family rituals, a ritual that reminds us where we Jews came from , the land that God promised us, and the freedom that is the right of Jews, and all decent members of the human race, from oppression, fear, and enslavement to evil ideas, and evil leaders. Nurtured with hatred for a past that largely never existed, a land that was more myth than reality, a history doctored to instill in him the idea that he --and only he-- and his people had suffered, had been refugees, had lost land and family; and that the only solution was bottomless hatred, death, self-destruction and murder, his prize would be a victory over a foe conjured from the worst excesses of primitive race hatred. It was a foe that didn't exist.

There was nothing one could have done, no compromise one could have offered, to have talked him out of his plans to kill two elderly Holocaust survivors, their only son and his family. The sound which I will never forget of Abed El-Bassat Odeh detonating ten kilo of explosives around his waist in a room full of grandparents and their children and grandchildren can never be answered in words. It is a language all its own. We've been negotiating in Israel for the last eight years. We have been answered in another language.

If we want to survive, the Jewish people in the land of Israel needs to speak the same language being spoken to us. This, I'm afraid, is my opinion, as unpopular and unpleasing as it may be to the ears of Western lovers of the concept, if not the practice, of peace. Shell-shocked, we wandered into the lobby of the Seasons hotel. Only around the corner, yet in parallel universe, families were gathered around beautifully set tables with ritual objects, singing traditional songs of the Passover hagadah.

My daughter-in-law's eyes darted around the room, looking at all the entrances and exits. My son embraced her. Akiva went back to our room and I joined him, wanting most of all to take off my soaking wet shoes and stockings. I sat in the bathtub, scrubbing my feet. For the first time, I saw the bloody napkin Akiva had been holding against the cut on his hand. Without a scratch, I'd kept thinking.

All of us. And now I realized, it wasn't true. We too had been harmed. I learned from police when I gave evidence the next day, that there had been two hundred people in the hotel lobby waiting for their Seder. Out of that number, 159 had been injured and twenty- two had been killed (another six were to die within the days to come). Among the dead was the woman I'd comforted in the lobby; and my father in law's good friend, the one he would have been sitting next to if we, his family, hadn't joined him for the Seder this Passover.

I thought of the bomb that had turned the downstairs of the Park Hotel into rubble as I cleansed the tiny scratch in my son's soft young flesh. And then I put my arms around him, his angular teenage body, and hugged him, allowing myself to think for the first time what could have been. And when my husband came in a moment later and my son retreated, embarrassed, to his own room, we held each other.

Our two sons, I told my husband, repeating it like a mantra. Our two sons. Finally, I allowed myself, for the first time, to cry. We rejoined our family in the lobby. It was suddenly very clear to me what I had to do. I went to the front desk and told them that we needed a seder table set for seven. Eventually, we gathered around it, pouring the wine, making the blessing over matzo, eating the bitter herbs and saltwater-dipped parsley.

If we were still alive, if we had escaped death, injury; if God himself had granted us deliverance from the horror and shielded us beneath His wings, what better way to give thanks than with the ancient words of the Passover Hagadah? It was, after all, what we Jews do. Survive. Generation after generation. "For not one time alone have they risen up against our fathers and ourselves to destroy us, but in every generation have they risen up against us to destroy us. But the Holy One, Blessed be He, delivers us from their hand." (From the Passover Hagadah) Copyright Naomi Ragen, April 2002.



Naomi Ragen


Dov, Pierre

21.05.2002 13:50

So, do you think that the Palestinian people are just plain evil? They are acting in the way that they do, purely because they are evil, not because they are desperate? The Palestinian women and children who just want educations for their kids etc - they are also just evil then I assume? Not normal people trying ot get on with their lives?

It's interesting that you make such comments about the way that these people are being trained to think and hate. Israel, obviously, does not enter into any sort of propaganda at all then? Israel has, at no point, told biased things to their people to keep them backing their efforts.........

.....Try to be a little more mature and balanced rather than the Hypocritical grizzling and bitching you have chosen here.

Share and enjoy......
Peace and love....

Paxman


George F. Will

21.05.2002 13:55

The Washington Post A War And Then A Wall

George F. Will Friday, August 17, 2001; Page A23

Among reasonable people, who are now impervious to the diplomats' anesthetizing imbecilities about "preserving" the Middle East "peace process," there is a crystallizing consensus: Israel needs a short war and a high wall. To understand the context of such thinking, consider what USA Today's Jack Kelley saw at the Aug. 9 terrorist bombing that killed 15 at the Jerusalem pizza restaurant. Kelley was 30 yards away when the terrorist detonated a bomb packed with nails:

"The blast sent flesh flying onto second-story balconies a block away. Three men were blown 30 feet; their heads, separated from their bodies by the blast, rolled down the glass-strewn street. One woman had at least six nails embedded in her neck. Another had a nail in her left eye. Two men, one with a six-inch piece of glass in his right temple tried to walk away. A man groaned. His legs were blown off. Blood poured from his torso. A 3-year old girl, her face covered with glass, walked among the bodies calling her mother's name. The mother was dead. One rabbi found a small hand against a white Subaru parked outside the restaurant."

As with the June bombing that killed 21 at a Tel Aviv disco, children were not collateral victims -- they were the targets. Abdallah al-Shami, a senior official of Islamic Jihad, celebrated "this successful operation" against "pigs and monkeys." Abdallhak also said, all Israeli civilians will be targeted.
We want to create fear and terror among every Israeli. That is a familiar rhetorical trope among those whom the calamitous Oslo "peace process" cast in the role of Israel's "partners for peace." In yet another of the constant violations of the Oslo requirement to stop anti-Jewish incitements, this was a recent broadcast from the moral cesspool that is the official television station of Yasser Arafat's Palestinian Authority: "All weapons must be aimed at the Jews whom the Koran describes as monkeys and pigs. We will enter Jerusalem as conquerors. Blessings to he who shot a bullet into the head of a
Jew."

The State Department, that brackish and bottomless lagoon of obtuseness, where Secretary of State Colin Powell has gone native with disgusting speed, will respond with the rhetoric of moral equivalence -- "both sides" must stop "the cycle of violence" -- to whatever Israel does in self-defense. On Tuesday the department sank to self-caricature when it denounced as "provocative" Israel's brief incursion into the West Bank in pursuit of the perpetrators of suicide bombings. Colin Powell see's Oil being more important, that Jewish children being massacred.

George F. Will


Re: "not humans"

21.05.2002 13:59

Why do you say they are not humans?

Clearly they are humans and you know this as well as I.

So what exactly do you mean when you say they are not humans?

Don't you know that humans are capable of evil?

Indeed humans are the *only* things capable of evil.
The scary thing is that we all have the capacity for evil within us.

It's not like there is an "evil gene" which makes Palestinians evil and other people alright. We all have the capacity for evil.

The Israeli occupation is bringing out the worst in people - both in the Israeli military and the suicide bombers.

As for Arafat being "no different from them" and therefore not being willing to stop them, well how do you know? Have you met him?

Do you think he could stop them if he wanted to? OK he is vaguely their leader but that doesn't mean he has the capacity to tell potential suicide bombers what to do. It's not like he says jump and they say how high.

Ozymandias


Stop being so Naive.

21.05.2002 14:04

Hmm - do we think all these stories are being provided to us by an Israeli Student Pressure group and Lobbying group in the US/Israel to try and curry favour???

Me thinks so...... rather an odd collection of unbalanced articles

Would these people have posted similar articles about how evil the IDF acted in refugee camps etc....?? Discussions about IDF shoting children indiscriminately through house walls? Perhaps not......

Paxman


Re: "not humans"

21.05.2002 14:04

Why do you say they are not humans?

Clearly they are humans and you know this as well as I.

So what exactly do you mean when you say they are not humans?

Don't you know that humans are capable of evil?

Indeed humans are the *only* things capable of evil.
The scary thing is that we all have the capacity for evil within us.

It's not like there is an "evil gene" which makes Palestinians evil and other people alright. We all have the capacity for evil.

The Israeli occupation is bringing out the worst in people - both in the Israeli military and the suicide bombers.

As for Arafat being "no different from them" and therefore not being willing to stop them, well how do you know? Have you met him?

Do you think he could stop them if he wanted to? OK he is vaguely their leader but that doesn't mean he has the capacity to tell potential suicide bombers what to do. It's not like he says jump and they say how high.

Ozymandias