I was impressed by Tony Benn's idea and felt he was one of the better speakers at the rally (and just about the only one who said anything I don't already know or haven't heard a hundred times). However it is interesting that the idea of sit-ins etc. to brng the cuntry to a halt was advocated at the same event where an attempt to do just that in Picaddily circus was so strongly opposed by the Stop the war Coalition stewards (see link below). Small disruptions in our home towns would be great, but when there were so many of us together, we could have caused some real disruption in the financial heart of the country.

Fuck The War!
Fuck The System!
Fuck The Party Line!

An hour is not enough.
Typical British understatement.
We should all get out on the streets and stay there,
maybe burning piles of money at the same time.
All non-urgent work should halt.
Haven't we all had just about enough of government?
Just think - although people seem to believe that we need government, imagine - things might just work better without it!

Kids who are home schooled are proving that they don't need 'government' to do well in life.
My own sons didn't go to secondary school and are doing very well at university.
It's only because people have become so accustomed to the abusive indoctrination which passes as education that they feel it must be right and necessary.
It could well be the same with the abuse of government coercion in our lives - maybe we just don't need it!

Time for humanity to grow up and say NO MORE

Yes sure we want this nightmare that's being perpetrated to end, with a fucking awful and corrupt government, and how do we deal with the hassle on the streets? This society is going to hell as a result of deliberate policy continuing from christ knows when. The deliberate withdrawal of the welfare state It's only the last six months we have to expose to shift the bastards.While watching out for what supplants it. Bush so thoughtless he could only be 'temporary' in his rituals - and Blair will doubtless follow - make sure these people are just temporary. Benn may have moved on from his tea-drinking socialism - why dont he turn his intellectualism in to full anger at the New Labour totalitarianism?

And what do you have in mind as an alternative ? War Lords ? A dictator ? The Tooth Fairy, perhaps ?

As children grow up (one hopes) and no longer need their parents, so humanity must grow up and take care of itself. Government has served it's purpose in our evolution and now it is time that we learned to be self-governing.
Government is a throwback from the days when people were ignorant and fearful of anyone who had a big stick. We are eminently capable of handling our own affairs with dignity and equality now.
Why does anything have to replace it? I find this a curious viewpoint. What? - do we need to make sure that we've still got an army in case our 'enemies' want to destroy us?
This is primitive thinking that goes along with the whole idea of the need to be 'governed'.
It would be tough at first but leaders arise naturally where they are needed - believe me.
Imagine a better world because it's possible. Only abuse victims get so depressed to believe that there's no other way.

Forgive my realism, but how exactly are we going to do this? Your perspective on evolution is spot-on, however I think your analogy to parent/child is not quite there, master/ slave describes it better.

"Only abuse victims get so depressed to believe that there's no other way." Said one post just above. I think that is a spot-on comment.

Because what is it that the capitalist system does? It is abuse. People have been abused for so long and the corporate media all the time tells people that this is the best it can get. People are told that it their fault: if something is wrong it is because you are stupid, not hard working etc. and told to believe in the American Way and the National Lottery.


Hence, we (whoever we might be) have to show that there are other ways of doing things so to raise the spirits of people. Just to mention a few things: MAI was stopped, WTO was stopped and WB/IMF was stopped. Strikes work, direct action works! People have organised collectively and improved their lot. IT IS NOT AS HARD AS IT SEEMS!

The best alternative to capitalism is no capitalism. All past revolutions have been built on a few slogans. Why does it have to be any different now? Why do we need a bloody blueprint for the next "stage" in history? If we have that we will not have a revolution (since there will be people disagreeing). I like the slogan "Overthrow capitalism and replace it with something nicer" - it sums it up for me, and it sums up what the diverse anti-cap/glob. movement is about...

With respect, many parent/child relationships are exactly what you say - master/slave.

First, we have to stop wondering "how are we going to do this?" It is the need to control that arises out of fear which has brought us to this terrible state of affairs.
When we just stop, in time we will return to the natural order of things because this is nature's way - health and happiness. Hard to believe I know, we are so trained to believe that we have to make something happen.
There is a phrase for it in the Tao - wu-wei or not forcing.
People must be brave enough to stop contributing to the system which they know is hurting us and our planet. It's no good to keep driving, making weapons, all the things which contribute to negativity and wait for others to do something. It is up to all of us to take back responsibility for our own lives.
Those who have children - home educate. Bring your children up to feel loved and valued - they will respond by becoming loving and feel responsible for their own lives. It is a wonderful thing and it takes time.
It took a long time to get into this fix - it will take a long time to get out of it. But we will.

Um.. what does stop contributing to the system really mean? do you not claim benefit (paid for by those who feed the system, organised and distributed on terms you may not ethically accept and used as a system of social control?) or do you work (and feed the system yourself)? And do you ever use manufactured products? Everything is connected through the system. In doing any of the above you are not "not forcing" whether you wish to or not. You are acting to produce actions that you may not agree with, whether you wish to create that effect or not. Non-action is not truely non-action.

There is no "natures way of health and happiness". Nature kills.

I agree that the need for control has brought us to this state of affairs but if we don't think, act and fight back, we cannot achieve anything. the system that controls and attacks may even kill us (if the threat is big enough).

We have to be responsible for our thoughts and actions. We have to love our children (and educate them in whichever way we can depending on our support systems and circumstances) but, practically again, not often really possible in the real events of people's lives - women struggling with domestic violence and poverty for example). We have to act, not stop. We have to act to change society, to make what we want to see happen. Think, push, force if necessary. Act.

Heather - oh yes, nature kills but it also gives birth, nurtures and sustains. Homeostasis - health and happiness is definitely nature's way, I have found it myself but it takes hard work to achieve. Hard work not to try and force things. It is difficult to explain to someone who is so obviously caught up in the current mindset.
And, when I mentioned stop contributing to the system, allow me to clarify. We should stop contributing in ways which we know hurt or harm - people or planet.
When we make the decision to do what is right, we are looked after. The planet is our mother and her breasts drip with milk for us as do any mother's for her babe. All we have to do is believe it.
I have lived in poverty, I still did not feel it necessary to send my children to indoctrination centres. If I had lived with domestic violence of course I would have acted. I do not advocate complete submission but it is possible to realise one's own personal revolution that can bring a different understanding and way of seeing the world, and this has its own effect upon the world, butterfly effect-style.
As the Dalai Lama knows that Tibet will be free one day, as eastern Europe became free from the shackles of communism, so we will also be free without the need to fight.