When you said the vast majority of people are middle class, what did you mean. The way i see it, there is two classes the ruling class - 'the ones with all the money (and make money -- wealth addicts)who manipulate the peple below them and keep them in check via the police, the army' and theres the notso opreesed but 'brainwashed so to speak- 'lower class' or 'masses' whatever you may call them...todays middle class working class and unemployed class make up this part. Surley there is a load of different people with different views and backgrounds in this 'lower class', but they sure have a lot to learn from each other, and thus when we learn...we can organise in a way that has never been seen before in this country.
when people say 'you got all your money off mummy and daddy',- remember--->you my son are an individual and you had no concept of what type of family youwouldbe born into, thus that should not be held against you.
Speak your mind, learn the truth, tell others...it's the only way to be.
I'm 16 and i like to speak my mind to people....don't ever give up and say it's hopeless trying to get through to them, i've done that myself and found myself becoming increasingly depressed. always say what you want to say, because there will be someone out there who WILL listen to you, even the unlikelyest of people.
Get out...say it out load, shout it from the rooftops...whatever.
For goodness sake...keep your freethinking up in yer noggin, know what i mean....it may be the best gift you have.
Solidarity.
CWRL

When I was talking about being lower class . What I meant was that whenever I see an argument between a communist and an anarchist in the comments section here. It always seems to degenerate into a “I’m poorer and therefore more working class and worthy of being left wing than you”. The impression I’m always given from. These arguments is that working class is comprised of only those people that work in factorys. I would say that after reading your decription my family are working class.
The impression that I was always given when reading comments on here before now was that in order to be a “true” anti-capitalist so to speak you had to be in serious trouble surviving in the current system.Anyone else was just sponging of rich mummy and daddy to get by. Anyway whatever.
I’m here to learn. Thanks for responding in such a friendly manner, I was expecting to get ripped into for being stupid or something.

Ben

firstly it is encouraging to see that not all our youth are stumbling blindy and living their life in ignorance in relation the true nature of global events.

secondly the fact that you are obviously a free thinker is a credit to who you are as an individual person and what you are prepared to tolerate.

my advice to you is simple the class war exists simply as another mechanism for dividing us into subgroups whilst keeping us at each others throats and distracting us from the true nature of the dirty business that is politics and power.
class is in two categories ruling and ruled and unless you are a multi millionaire with seats on the board of some majorly powerful multi nat then consider yourself to be the latter like the rest of us

the class war is bullshit it is pragmatic and dogmatic and my advice to you is to work towards what you are currently striving to become a more humanitarian and compassionate individual who is true both to himself and others.


arguements have raged within the movement for years if i were you i would just blank it out and concentrate on lending your voice to the cause that troubles you the most be it human rights anti fascism environmental anti war but whatever you do stay away from the class war as the rhetoric will likely become a distraction that you could well do without.

i myself come from a very poor family in scotland sometimes we struggled to have food on the table when i was younger but this has not made me anti or hostile towards those who have had a more comfortable upbringing.

each individual is unique and we can't choose our family nor background as long as you are true of heart you will be accepted by the large majority of the movement whether commie anarchist or any other label attached to various focal or campaign groups.

peace

Nuggett!!!

the masses are gathering
the revolution is near
death to the fascist regime!!!

I agree with what others have said here.

Please don't be put off by these more-working-class-than-thou types, they're only a small (if vocal!) minority, stroking their own egos. I'd bet most of them haven't been on a demo in years.

If you're for justice and peace, and prepared to protest against the truly wealthy and powerful, you're very welcome.

My advice is to get involved in practical action; go to some meetings and/or protests and see if there are any groups you'd like to get involved with. Much better to judge groups by action than words.

And well done mate! Welcome to the movement!

Nice One internationalist - could'nt have put it better myself...


Here's a cuople of useful links for contacting groups etc


www.schnews.org.uk
Schnews is the weekly activists freesheet


 http://www.fraw.org.uk/
free range activism - loads of links to groups & campaigng

 http://alt.venus.co.uk/weed/links.html
weeds links - one of the biggest links pages to activists sites I have seen

good point in a way, because all this crap about who's more working-class is crap. we just have to accept that the anti-capitalist movement IN THE NORTH is unfortunately mostly middle-class. the much larger one in the southern hemisphere is mostly working-class.

however i think that we are NOT "all middle-class" now as the politicians want us to believe. the largest section of society is still working-class, albeit not dominated by manual workers anymore. the middle-class is that which has some significant political power e.g. managers, lawyers, teachers and the police. it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with money, although you can't get rich working-class. its all about power.

in a revolution then the middle-class will split, some going to the aid of the working-class, some staying with their tongues stuck to the boots of the ruling-class and the rest milling about wondering what they're going to do.

i don't mind the fact that there's a load of middle-class people in the movement. the middle-class has produced some great revolutionaries (sylvia pankhurst being one of my favourite), the only problem is when they come over all patronising and want to lead the working-class (like nearly all left parties) instead of engaging in the struggle with them on an equal basis. really, commitment to the class struggle is all that's needed, but as the middle-class benefit to a certain degree they tend to ask for less radical change.

anyway, better that the middle-class become impotent hippies sitting in the street yelling peace at the revolution, than accept the system and help it in its attacks on the working-class


jc

finally a topic which everyone can agree on without name calling and sectarianism. i think sometimes we forget how much we have in similar and just focus on differences.
im 16 and i used to be like you not very long ago so i understand what your feeling but you almost get used to it after a while. its definitely something people have got to sort out. the working class has been misdefined constantly as some factory worker. the working class is everyone who gets money by labour (e.g. factory worker, doctor, secretaries etc) while the ruling class is that which own property and make money from property (business owners, landlords etc)
class is like this really, everyone can and should take part in the movement BUT society can be analysed into classes each of which behaves in a slightly different way. the orthodox marxist viewpoint adopted by all lefties and some anarchists is that you basically have the proletariat, the petit bourgoies and bourgoies. the first two are poor while the bourgoies are the professionals and generally richer people. however, people are only un-revolutionary when they own land or businesses since giving the workers more pay means less profit. therefore if you're a doctor you would support higher wages since you are in fact a worker while the corner-shop owner who is poorer than the doctor would rather have lower wages since he might employ a few workers. that's why class is based on ownership of land and property rather than how rich you are. the richer someone is the less LIKELY that he is revolutionary but does not say HOW revolutionary he is.
as for boycotting brands its pointless and inactive. if you go out of your way to do it. you also put yourself at risk or becoming one of those people really focussed on fashion as much as politics. im not saying you are just i used to be like that as well and a lot of new people are.

Why not boycott brands....i mean one person doing it wont mean very much but it's a start. Why work for them.
From the day we are born we are geared towards a consumer-society. Only recently has the anti-capitalist movement become more and more known and it's doing well at fucking up this 'consumer-society' with boycotts, demos...etc.
It hasn't gained enough support yet, partly due to the corporate media, thats why i think this years mayday events should be aimed at tackling corporate media. How are they going to report they're rubbish when they're HQ's are being surrounded and stormed! no reporters will be able to get to and from their base.....imagine murdoch/sky news off-air for a day or two. or we even could take their airwaves and broadcasting units and use'em.
(p.s notice on these comments pages how conversations are linked, one thing leads to another, pretty good, eh?)
Solidarity.

Ahh, I think there's some encouraging comments once in a while. I'm only 17, but what I've noticed recently is a real awakening to new ideas particularly in people of my age range, and cynicism is weakening. Political action is just transferring from the ballot box to the streets as the coup d'etat of governance worldwide by the WTO continues.
I think this has much to do with aspects of globalisation, as children of the barren eighties become the `No Logo' generation.
The momentum built up through anti-war protests from September I felt very strongly, as I'd never been so politically active with such urgent and angry feeling. What I think's a shame is the way young people who feel compassion can easily get dragged into the SWP, etc, rather than becoming freer, and creative thinkers. It can be extremely daunting being surrounded by bad literature and recruiting faces when you're at a protest for social justice, especially for the first time, but such political orthoxy makes disillusionment with social change far more likely too. Vive l'anarchie.
This movement, I am certain, will continue to grow as cynicism turns to political activism,. Arguing about who's more working class or anything won't get us anywhere, and all seems very dumb. Let's shut up and deal with the issues. Lets communicate with those who don't know, or don't even want to know about what's going on in the world- who's fucking it and us up and why- and build on what we know to work for change. Someone's got to do, and if not us, who?

We used t' sleep down coal mine, and ate rat gruel and if father came 'ome, he'd kick us int' teeth and we thanked him for it.

If we want to build a classless society, we must accept that everyone is equal- if you're commited to the revolution, it doesn't matter whether you were born into a working class, middle class or bourgeous (sp?) family. Being working class just gives you a headstart when it comes to understanding the plight of workers- but if they try, anyone can understand it.

(for those having trouble, try  http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html
-it helped me)

And communists arguing with anarchists seems a bit silly too, since the untimate goal of communism is to create an anarchist society- the communist bit is just an interim to get people used to the idea of sharing.

Solidarity!