Skip to content or view screen version

ISO(sister org of s.w.p.)'hijack student a\war coalition in u.s

concerned | 14.11.2001 16:29

intersting post fron u.s thatneeds to be read, thought about, while noting there are some differences between
s.w.p and i.so.

please note this is onepersons contribution and there will be other narratives(very post modern!).I wiil post other
responses when indymedia stops crashing.



Why did the ISO lie to us all and bring us up here this weekend, only to push and build and ISO coalition. if I wanted to be in the ISO i would have joined the organiziation.

Berkeley Conference Hijacked by the ISO
This weekend I attended the CSAW (California Schools Against War) Conference held in Berkley. I go to school in Santa Barbara. I came to this meeting thinking that I was going to work with other schools and help in regard of making solid plans to bring to our campus and help to plan. I was looking for ideas, for suggestions, a bit of suggestion and also I wanted to know where other students stood on the Anti-War stance.

What ended up happening was just this enormous and very upsetting event. The conference started with a panel on Saturday morning. No other students from other schools spoke during this time, mainly people from Berkley. Lunch was served.Workshops were held and I viewed the workshops as the best thing that came out of my traumatizing weekend. The next day on Sunday there was a delegation meeting. The Berkeley group without asking any other schools had decided to only allow 5 delegates from each school to be involved in the voting and decision making process during this conference. So 5 delegates from each school who basically named themselves delegates were picked to make choices for their entire school without even having a chance to speak with the other members from their school. From the time the process of the delegation meeting started it was doomed to fail. In NO WAY was there talk of process, all 190 people were basically TOLD that we would have to be in a majority voting process without it EVER being discussed. We were just told this was how things were going to be, no discussion was even held about this. Please remember that we have 45 schools present at this conference, non of which were told that they had a choice between consensus decision making process, majority voting, or other forms of decision making. There was no access to a list server or phone conference calls by schools, we were told that there were email list servers, I know my schools and a few others who tried numerous times to contact The Berkley Stop the War Coalition but our emails went unanswered. Nothing about the process and the format of this conference regarding how we were going to make decisions were known, and there were many people there who were very young, and this was their first event like this who expressed over and over they did not understand the process and felt like they were shut down, glossed over or just plain ignored.

Back to the conference, they asked the schools to put forth proposals that we wanted to be voted on. There were 25 proposals in all and we had from 10:00 AM – 4:00 PM to get through them all. The first proposal was to establish a coordinating committee. So basically we were asked to instead of having 5 delegates from each school which is already undemocratic, we were now being asked to have only 1 delegate representing each school, forming basically a body of government working within this coalition. How can that even happen? how can we only have 1 representative from each school communicating and bringing forth the entire schools anti-war perspective? is this right? well we didn't think so, but that didn't matter since we were the minority by votes and the first proposal that started our meeting was passed. Time ticked on and all types of proposals regarding Days of Action, consumer boycott after Thanksgiving, March to DC, and various other “important” proposals were passed or thrown aside… in the meantime people are raising their hand and being told by the Facilitator/moderator that they don’t have time and they can’t talk. Dialogue was being cut off, and discussions were told that they could not go on because we didn’t have time. Over and over they stopped taking stack and told people not to raise their hands, over and over people stood up and asked for clarification, and asked to be heard and they were shut down. A young man in the back stood up and said that this process was undemocratic, and that people have even stopped voting, because they did not understand what was going on, since everything was being cut off and stopped. People were becoming frustrated and asking to be heard, at this point the facilitator looked confused and sent everyone to lunch. During lunch groups started to gather and the words of confusion and being upset were in the air, groups were talking about walk outs, and they were talking about confronting this the minute they went back in.

Once we came back into he hall, hands went up and people wanted a Process Point, wanted a stop to the voting so that certain things could be said, this AGAIN was ignored, glossed over and the voting continued. As this was going on I watched a young lady with a few others sitting in rows behind her stand up and walk out into the hall, about 15 minutest later they came back and went towards the podium, and asked from a Process Point. An older middle eastern man stood up and asked that the student groups please please involve more middle eastern people and not ignore the things we want to say, and to please reach out to the middle eastern groups in regards to organizing against the war. One womin went up and asked that there please be more discussion before we vote so that we can all know what we are voting for, so that we can all know what information to take back to our campus and present to the groups we were supposed to be representing.

She also asked for a more democratic voting process, because she did not feel comfortable at all in the situation that was going on. After her another young womin who was middle eastern spoke and basically pleaded with the group to include more voice of the middle eastern people and to not please leave them out, her voice was shaking as she was saying this, and she said that many of her friends and comrades had felt very very isolated from the white/academia community and felt like nobody was listening to them. After her 2 people from the conference organizing group stood up who were middle eastern and said that there are many middle eastern groups that are not against the war and that’s why they were not there.

The Facilitator said that he wanted to vote for us to either continue w/ the majority voting process or move towards a consensus decision making process. A vote was actually taken for this, but nobody actually explained what consensus or majority voting is, nobody said anything about it, and again there were so many people there who had no idea what consensus even was, so how was this a fair vote?

With a all this going on I watched as the two girls who made the process point, two women of color I might add who had the guts to walk up in front of a huge group and ask for there to be a voice. They walked out of the meeting, many people followed them, as the rest of the body continued voting and deciding things. I was in shock basically, I have never in the few years I have been trying to dedicate my life to organizing around issues such as these have I seen such blatant disrespect and undemocratic process unfold.

I ended up leaving the meeting, and outside in the hallway I heard from the groups that had gathered that there was going to be holding a small meeting out on the steps of the Life Science Hall, they invited anyone who was upset about the decision making process to come join them and voice their concerns, since they were not being allowed to inside the meeting.

I decided to go to that meeting, and I counted 59 other people who felt the way I did, and who also had major concerns. Women spoke about how they the entire was so sexist, and that they were cut off over and over when they tried to bring up issues, people of color spoke out about how they did not feel included in this process from day one, other schools talked about why have both these California conferences, just happen to end up in Berkley, why are they not rotating? People from the Queer community talked about they felt like they did not have a space or voice to talk. In general people talked about how they feared speaking up and did not feel like they should, so they just bit their tongue and continued with the process. The most interesting part was when about 5 people who were actually part of the group from Berkley who organized this conference came to our meeting and told us that they had so many problems also regarding these issues, and they had never fixed them. A group of them continued speaking and told us that they felt like the presence of ISO members and ISO regional coordinator a man named Todd was what was the breaking point of this conference. New information was revealed that the facilitator name Snehal who has been cutting people off left and right when they brought opposition views was an ISO member, more was revealed when we found out the people making proposals and being put on head of planning coordinating committees were all ISO people, that the people who wanted to organize the march to DC were ISO members, the people in charge of the next conference and coordinating committee were ISO members, that the contact person from the Southern California Schools Against War a man I think named BJ was an ISO member, and he was the only contact the Southern California schools had been able to have with Berkley because the Berkley folks would not return the emails of others who were inquiring.

Personally I know we have all heard things about this group, but I don’t belong to any affiliation, I consider myself a socialist actually, I have never felt the need to call them out or point these issues out about them up until now because this was such a blatant undemocratic tactic that was used by them. I have very personal politics Im able to distinguish a time and a place to bring those personal political structural ideas forth. This conference entirely failed to do that. Beneath a cloud of secrets, non-transparency, non-communication, and blockade of involvement this conference was held as an ISO platform related event disguised as an open Coalition of Schools organizing against the war in Afghanistan. The entire platform and structure that was designed and reinforced by forming these special committees and assigning one delegate from each school. The entire fact that no communist, or anarchist views or speakers were allowed to join, be present or speak on the panel, the very idea that the people organizing this thought that people were too stupid to be able to make a choice between consensus and majority vote, so they made that decision for them, they did not think that these group of students who are good enough to outreach, organize and build a movement. But they are not good enough to be given the choice of which democratic process they want to use in making decisions. Im very sad that I even have to write this long essay, but the fact remains we are fighting a system right now, we are fighting against a war. The US is using so many issues regarding Afghanistan to justify their actions in bombing and killing the people in that region, they are lying to us, they are hiding things from us, they think we are too stupid to figure it out and make a wise decision ourselves. This is the same thing that happened this weekend as I watched it unfold. I hate this bickering and name calling between groups as much as the next person, but Im able to realize that we need to do this, we need to be able to see when this type of racist, sexist domination is being done. When we are being told lies, and having a front group being coordinated but behind the mask there is a political party, and a political agenda. I never not once before this weekend have I attacked the ISO or had even one bad thing to say about them, but this blatant cover up, this blatant lies and secrecy have no place in our movement, they have no place in our lives. This group has proven to be wonderful politician, but please try to remember it was the politicians who have brought us all to this place, it was their lies and decent that have become all of our problems. Enough is enough, stop the bull shit, if the ISO wanted a Anti War School Coalition, they should have called it the ISO Anti War School Coalition, at least I would respect them for being honest in doing that, stop the bull shit, you can only lie and try to trick people for so long. The “masses” as the ISO calls them are NOT stupid.

add your own comments

concerned

Comments

Hide the following 12 comments

please be accurate

14.11.2001 17:32

Whilst I realise that various individuals like to spend all there time trying to have a go at the SWP, if your going to try to make a snide accusation, get your facts straight our sister organisation in the states is left turn as you can see if you look at the URL provided. We had problems with what we felt were the sectarian ways the organisation was operating as you can also find out on that URL

noel
mail e-mail: noel@freemachine.net
- Homepage: http://www.swp.org.uk/INTER/INTER.HTM


The ISO is NOT the SWP's sister organisation

14.11.2001 17:39

The ISO is not the sister organisation of the SWP in the US and has not been for over a year. The British SWP broke with the ISO because of its sectarian attitude towards the anti-globalisation movement. This was linked to the British SWP's more collaborative approach towards other left organisations in the Socialist Alliance etc.

So, GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT, baconbrain, before you lauanch into yet another time-wasting bone-headed attack on the SWP.

Bill


SWP/ISO/L T- ALL THE SAME !!

14.11.2001 20:13

Just come across good definition of trots from American Heretics Dictionary:

TROTSKYISM, n. Stalinism deprived of state power. Few in number though fractious, one Trotskyist constitutes a 'split';two constitute a 'group'; and three constitute a 'movement'.

Hence 57 varieties of shite.
Sorted!

paul


Definition

14.11.2001 21:49

STUDENTS from WEALTHY PARENTS.

Ronnie.


guys, guys

15.11.2001 09:21

Hey you guys, relax. Like the man says, the British SWP is "more collaborative" than the American ISO and you can see this by the way they work in the socialist alliance. I'd just add Globalise Resistance and the Stop the War Coalition, two other collaborative alliances where the SWP work alongside other groups and people.

Of course, if you object to the way the government-voting SWP run these broad alliances (giving Labour politicians platforms at any opportunity, preventing direct action being discussed, marginalising anti-capitalists) you're clearly a "baconbrain" involved in a "time-wasting bone-headed attack on the SWP". So shut up you dishevelled lot and carry one of our placards when you're told!

see you sunday...

xx

Jane beardsley


In defence of the SWP

15.11.2001 11:10

Dear Ronnie

As a member of the SWP I admit to being middle-class and yes I have been a student,my parents however are not wealthy,have never been and both had childhoods spent in poverty.

Maybe you could provide evidence of how many SWP members you know in person to justify to your claim that we're all middle class fakers?. Also you might like to consider the fact that many revolutionaries whilst not coming from the working class were fully committed to the cause(Marx say or
Lenin)

All the best

Claire the Librarian

Claire the Librarian
mail e-mail: clairenatashya@hotmail.com


unite to crush students!

15.11.2001 17:35

The problem is our movement is dominated by all these bourgeois elements like students, academics, people with mortgages, office workers, gay people, women.. We must purge these class enemies and base our movement on folk like me who never even went to school (cause I was too hard and street) so never even learned to write or access the internet.. oops!

(okay I lied about retiring)

a nonny mouse


No Defence for the Indefensible

17.11.2001 01:56

Dear Claire the Librarian,
Hope you get to read this!

You made some points which I would like to discuss.
I must say I found it interesting that you did not challenge the definition of Trotskyism which I posted up. A
little too accurate for comfort?

However you felt able to challenge Ronnies definition of the swp, as STUDENTS from WEALTHY PARENTS, why?
Ronnies description is, I feel, succinct and accurate, reflecting many concerns that anarchists have about the whole swp/globalise resistance sham, which your leadership have decreed should now infiltrate and control the anti-capitalist movement.

History shows us that these leninist/trotskyist groups, with their 'vanguard' mindset and divisive scripted rheotoric, never have a positive effect on any movement they attempt to lead.
Inevitably the leaderships concern is to recruit people, then shape their views until they hold the correct party line (is it any wonder that so many see the swp as a cult?)

The recruitment strategy of the swp, as layed down by an anonymous leadership (care to enlighten us, Claire), predominantly targets middle class students in their early time at college/university. Could that be because these students are seen as vulnerable, and away from home for the first time? (oooh very cultish)
Maybe there's an additional reason for this recruitment strategy - a financial one perhaps?
These are the same middle class graduates who are expected to get well paid employment - more cash for the party coffers.
And so what if a lot of them 'burn out' with the incessant demands for their time, money, and attendence at meetings.
After all there's always more to recruit at next years freshers days!

Students from Wealthy Parents.......makes a lot more sense when you see the swp for the cynical opportunists they are

As for there being some noteable examples of middle class people involved in 'the cause'. I might agree, but with one proviso, look very carefully at what their cause was!

In the case of Marx, his earlier works ie. the 1844 Paris Manuscripts, gave way to a latent authoritarianism. It was this which led to Lenin, Trotsky, and Stalin overseeing the replacement of one set of rulers for another, and the inevitable dictatorship of the Party.

The need of Marx and his followers, to dominate the proceedings of the First International highlighted tactics, which have become synonamous with marxist/leninist/trotskyist groups
the slurring of those they disagree with, the forcing out of dissent(ers), and even the destruction of a viable revolutionary movement if they couldn't control it.

If you're interested in confirming any of the above points, feel free to check out the anarchist faq website, read some stuff - Freedom Press is a solid starting point, or pick up an anarchist leaflet/paper on Sunday.
Don't worry, you won't be expected to endorse or join anything. Anarchists believe in mutual aid and voluntary co-operation, not the manipulation and control freakery that comes with 'democratic' centralism.

All the best
Paul

Paul
mail e-mail: stateyourenemy@aol.com


Dear Paul

17.11.2001 12:56

Dear Paul

Cheers for your e-mail.

I didn't post a comment about your definition of Trotskyism as I was replying to Ronnie-not because it was too close for comfort!. Re:your definition of Trotskyism as Stalinism without the power-base,could you provide evidence that if Trotsky had become the leader of the Soviet Union that he would have behaved in a similar fashion. Remember that it was Uncle Joe that Lenin told the party to beware on his death bed.

Why do you feel Ronnie's description of the SWP to be accurate?-it's fine to have feelings but can you back them up?.

If the SWP is as you describe a cult then why is it never publicsed as such by the mainstream media?. I'd also contest your view as students as young,vunerable and naive.
When I joined the SWP it was after being involved in politics for a number of years-likewise for my friends a number of whom were mature students.

I've got a lot more to say but i'm about to finish my lunch break-i've read archanist stuff in the past but will check out your website and make comments on it!.

Claire the Librarian

Claire the Librarian
mail e-mail: clairenatashya@hotmail.com


Response to Claire.

17.11.2001 18:00

Hello Claire,
Sorry I didn't reply sooner, but I only heard about your posting earlier today. If you ever get the chance to come up to Liverpool, you will see that the membership of the cliffhangers here consists entirely of middle-class people. Being working-class is a fact of life and not an ideological viewpoint as Meltzer said. Your comrades might be sympathetic to the class, but that doesn't make them part of it. After Icepick head's exploits at Kronstadt and in the Ukraine, do you think he would have been any improvement on Stalin? The Bolsheviks were the greatest counter-revolutionaries of the last century. The leadership of the SWP (who are not even recognised as Trotskyist by sections of the British left) are simply carrying out the historic mission of their class by attempting to muscle in on real workers initiatives and thwart them. The real anti-fascism of sections of the class is mirrored in the antics of the ANL, Globalise Resistance is a counterfeit movement designed to impose themselves on the anti-globalisation of real workers. The Socialist Alliance is another matter. The SWP didn't even want to know anything about it when it was started up. When it looked as though there might be some milage in it, along come the SWP to muscle in and take over (Vote for Red Ken, Londons Marxist Mayor). No, I don't need some ex-army officer like Foot and his red fascist pals to tell me what to do. I don't need a couple of dead Russians doing it either. I've got enough live English bastards trying that. Middle-class Revolutionaries? My arse.

Ronnie.

Ronnie.


Response to Ronnie

19.11.2001 13:58

Dear Ronnie

I have to admit that i've never been to Liverpool so can't comment on that in all fairness-just as you can't comment on my experience of knowing a great number of SWP members over the last 10 years. Yes I admit that a number of the SWP are middle class, a great number aren't.

Re:Your comments about Trotsky owing to the course of history we'll never know for sure-I honestly believe that he would have behaved differently to Stalin.

Re: Your definition of Foot et al as facists-do you honestly think that a party set up by someone who was Jewish and lost family in the concentration camps would be
a facist organisation.

Re:your comment "middle class revolutionaries...
take people as you find them and don't pre-judge them!

Claire the LIbrarian


Response to Claire.

20.11.2001 17:27

Greetings again Claire. I couldn't be bothered debating class politics with the middle-class, so this will be my last post on the subject. The SWP are opportunists, mostly middle class, perhaps guilty at not being born into the working class and are a joke on just about any picket line they turn up on. We'll be on strike fairly shortly and as the union rep, I won't be too pleased if Fiona and Tarquin turn up on our picket line with their petitions and crappy newspapers. I'll be reaching for the icepick as soon as the Shit Wipers start chanting through that megaphone with their braying estuary English accents. It's a class thing, you wouldn't understand.

Ronnie.

Ronnie.