I don't understand. Firstly, I am an anarchist and I don't mind what clothes you wear I just want to fight for justice, equality and freedom with other comrades. Secondly, I have not been on a demonstration since 2000 and I can't understand a lot of the jargon. What are 'white overalls' and 'black block'? Are you talking about the Wombles versus the balaclava people? While the Wombles are a strategic and humourous but non-violent force within demonstrations (I've never seen them myself), I can't see why they would be opposed. What's this 'seizing the state' bullshit? Surely we're about destroying the state, not seeking yet another oppression? As for the balaclavas, they just look like the kind of people that join terrorist groups, although they are quite harmless. Wearing a balaclava is like joining the army - you've lost your individuality and you look like you're prepared for war. Just more masculine pride stuff going on, rather than a serious political point being made.

Your defamation of all leftist political movement which aren´t d´accord with your political aims (which are completely invisible to me besides some primitive money-rules-the-world clichee) is nothing but disgusting!

You tell that "a black bloc never existed in italy"! Well one could argue what you mean by "black bloc" but from the context it seems that you mean the militant autonomous left as a whole - and that is, especially for italy, a LIE so big that I wish you choke from it!

One more thing: It´s a clear fact that e.g. one of the "most important" persons of the Ya Basta / Tute Bianche (White Overalls)is officialy working with the italian social ministery.

Ya Basta / Tute Bianche (White Overalls) for me is a big step back for the radical left, in therms of theory as well as practical forms of struggle.

A more detailed criticism of the current movement can be read at  http://www.antideutsch.de/hirn.html
It´s only available in german yet but perhaps babelfish can help a bit, also it was announced that a translation was underways.

First of all, you haven't read anything, you've only pretended to do it. How could have we stated that the autonomous left never existed in Italy, when we are part of it ourselves?

By "Black Bloc" we mean a notorious informal network of affinity groups taking direct action at demos. This network adopts specific tactics and is mostly composed by anarchists and a few ultra-radical leftists. It has a flexible way of organizing, and a well recognizable style and sartorial rhetoric.
This "Black Bloc" never existed in Italy. It is UNDENIABLE.

ABSOLUTELY NO MEMBER OF YA BASTA! IS WORKING WITH ANY FUCKING MINISTER OF SOCIAL AFFAIRS. THIS IS OLD DRY BULLSHIT, IN ITALY SUCH A LIE DOESN'T WORK ANYMORE, THUS SLANDERERS ARE TRYING TO SPREAD IT ELSEWHERE.

Beware your friends, comrade: they're fucking your brains over by feeding it with crap and misinformation.

Our document sets the records straight and is the most authorative text on Italian white overalls available in English.

Ya Basta! are far from a step backward in social and political struggle; rather they and Zapatism inspired organisations are the biggest and most important thing to hit the European scene for many, many years. Their determination to be both non-violent and yet confrontational, their organisation whilst avoiding authoritarianism, and their frank honesty in the face of what largely seems to be typical ultra-communist bullshit is admirable.

Long live Ya Basta!

Matt

the only problems i have with the White Overalls is

a)friends of mine being threatened with violence by them if they don't demonstrate their way. no I'm not going to put names or details here, I'm not that stupid
b)having demonstations dictated by them ie we do the front line, you stay at the back eg prague
c)being told i'm anti revolutionary if i choose to question them in any way instead of immediately saying how great they are

that said
the concept is cool
the practice isn't
shame about that

Dear bob, have you ever attempted to stop someone who is setting fire to a car or smashing a shop window during a demo? Have you ever thought to convince our brothers and sisters in balaclava not to follow their plan of action during a demo??? I haven't and will never do anything like that because I respect, appreciate and fanatically support the diversity that exists within the movement. If I don't agree on the methods that some groups are practicing I simply don't join them but it doesn't mean that I HAVE to sabotage their actions or that I don't support them!
I have a friend who joined non-white overalls radical groups during a global day of action abroad. He stupidly wanted to stop a guy who was smashing a decrepit car that visibly didn't belong to a powerful and rich person. My friend ended up in hospital with his nose fractured by an activist...and, like yourself, I'm not so stupid to name people and details!!! My friend was punched on his nose and was called an 'anti-revolutionary-reformist shit'. Is the treatment that my friend received from those 'radical activists' so different from the way the white overalls dealt with your friend (and you?)in prague? Don't you believe that 'our friends' are a bit naive in thinking that they can change demo strategies in a way that is likely to sabotage what people have been preparing for months???
morgana

it's a shame that we always have to fight against each other.
surely it would be better to concentrate our limited time and resources and channel them into fighting for social justice. ya basta have done a lot to further this aim in Italy, but nobody is perfect and we all have our faults.
ya basta, organized a trip for 250 Italians to mexico to accompany marcos on the march to mexico city, (along with other groups from europe) The criticism of ya basta seems very weak and petty when you take into concideration the positive things they have done. The fact that this discussion is taking place is already very positive.big thanx to indymedia.
we all preach about how horrible and intolerant the capitalist society is, but if we are going to change anything the first thing we need to learn is to be tolerent ourselves LB

PS caro ya basta, if you need help with translating your shit I can help. get in touch  luther_blissett@aruba.it

what you saying here?
wot the fuck has some dickhead hitting your friend got to do with me?
What I'm talking about is people from an organisation identifying themselves as representitives from that organisation in order to use the power that name invokes and then threatening to physically attack people if they didn't behave how they wanted them to. This did not happen during the course of a riot or anything like that. It happenedBEFORE a demo. If people are going to do thissort of shit using the name of the organisation they belong to then the group in question should be held responsible.

I am not part of any group and will not be held responsible for the actions of some arsehole who hits your friend.

this is exactly what i meant in the first place when i said that i get shit if i so much as question ya basta. i am not saying that ya basta are all bad i am saying they piss me off but since their big international media debut at prague if i dont say they're perfect then i'm anti revolutionary reactionist scum. fuck that.

people all over the world from greece to new york to new zealand have seen the video footage from the ya basta owned and operated yellow march from the prague demo and assumed that their tactics for playing games with cops are all there is to them without ever hearing anything about the politics and decision making process of the group. and now there is some big fucking write up on indymedia saying 'please dont pick on us' from ya basta.

dont question
dont demonstrate YOUR way on OUR demo
believe all we say, all else is lies

fuck that shit

love
bob

Bob, this is ridiculous. I'm sorry my friend, but to me it just sounds like you're pissed of that Ya Basta get so much attention. It's one thing to critisize different methods or incidents, which I think is important for our organizations to evolve. But we should do it with the understanding that we're all part of the same movement and that all of us are important and that we respect eachother's work.

Okay, so some people wearing the white overalls have maybe done some stupid things, as have autonomous anarhists and communists. Maybe Ya Basta have been controlling on some demonstrations. If this is so then it's definately worth discussing to find some good solutions and MOVE ON with our work. But slandering eachother is just completely destructive for our whole movement. Meanwhile the people in power are getting richer and fatter each day off the work of poor people. Let's remember our goals and be supportive of our sisters and brothers.

"Scary" Communist said:
"Your defamation of all leftist political movement which aren´t d´accord with your political aims (which are completely invisible to me besides some primitive money-rules-the-world clichee) is nothing but disgusting!"

This has to be some of the most ignorant statement I've ever heard! You're doing exactly what you're accusing the White Overalls of doing. It's obvious to me that they are, in their whole article, only talking about "idiots who call themselves anarchists", ie they're only talking about INDIVIDUALS and there was no defamation of any movements in the text AT ALL. They even said very clearly on several occasions that they deeply respect and support the anarchist and autonomous movement. That means they deserve the same respect from us!