I cant help thinking...
Ian H | 02.05.2001 12:01
...that this site is just a load of left wing propaganda, rather than an independent view of the news. The unbelieveable bias shown in your editorial makes you as bad as anyone else. Damn, that hypocrite phrase is on the tip of my tongue again.
Ian H
e-mail:
london_ian@yahoo.com
Comments
Hide the following 38 comments
see above
02.05.2001 12:09
tom collins
e-mail: tomcolluins88@hotmail.com
erm,
02.05.2001 12:12
Ian H
e-mail: london_ian@yahoo.com
There is no such thing as unbiased journalism
02.05.2001 12:25
You just have to look at the corporate news to see that. However there is journalistic integrity, and the indymedia has that I think.
And "independent" means the media center doesn't belong to any corporation or company, is voluntary and organized horizontally through direct democracy and consensus.
Daniel
Daniel
lardy dar!
02.05.2001 12:30
flip
e-mail: gnvqli13@reaseheath.ac.uk
unbiased media
02.05.2001 12:35
anon
What's independent?
02.05.2001 12:37
I'm not involved with any of the groups participating yesterday - but I felt this site gave a more detailed, more up to date and a less hysterical version of yesterday's events.
You can never get completly objective news coverage - so listen to both sides and keep an open mind
Mark
ok
02.05.2001 12:39
Ian H
An explanation?
02.05.2001 12:59
Another factor must be that "left-leaning" people and contributors are more likely to be attracted to a site such as this, since the right-wing are more often than not amply catered for by Murdoch et al. And as a site seems to have such a tendancy , it attracts even more from the left due to reputation.
Whichever of these you agree with (or even if you don't agree with any), I think most would agree that Indymedia does a fantastic job of challenging mainstream media propaganda.
Genoseize Therat
e-mail: genoseize@hotmail.com
Homepage: http://www.genoseize.co.uk
Breaking News (and wind)
02.05.2001 13:33
Un Biased
Read their mission statement
02.05.2001 13:39
Extract:
"Inherent in the mainstream corporate media is a strong bias towards Capitalism's power structures, and it is an important tool in propagating these structures around the globe. While the mainstream media conceal their manifold biases and alignments, we clearly state our position. Indymedia UK does not attempt to take an objective and impartial standpoint: Indymedia UK clearly states its subjectivity."
Read the full statement at:
http://uk.indymedia.org/ms.php3
I agree with other here, they provided the fullest and most factual reporting of the events in the streets yesterday.
Peter J
Homepage: http://uk.indymedia.org/ms.php3
no such thing
02.05.2001 15:21
mainstream media is shit, owned by companies only interrested in making money, brainwashing people and not telling the "truth"!!! if there is such a thing as truth.
cu
jojo
jojo
e-mail: jojo@redbricks.org.uk
Homepage: http://www.redbricks.org.uk
Bias? Give me overt bias anyday!
02.05.2001 15:39
As you can see, your biased piece about bias on this site was quite happily published. Anyone can publish. Publish or be damned!
Colonel Panic
What Independent Means?
02.05.2001 17:01
Sheffield Mayday
e-mail: sheffieldmayday@disinfo.net
winging it
03.05.2001 00:20
greenity hall
e-mail: greenity@hotmail.com
just a thought
04.05.2001 11:08
freethinker
Re: mainstream media is shit
04.05.2001 11:23
The "independent" (no relation) isn't too bad....
BTW I think we got the guardian on our side
pretty much by the end of it..
Hugh Jones
The Guardian and The Independent
04.05.2001 12:16
I can't help feeling the IMC is in a competly different sphere, although as a activist news wire for activists it executes it's role effectivly as well. As for bias - i'd rather have the IMC's viewpoint that a well-paid, comfortable jurnolists "objective" opinion. Sometimes the BBC is so objective it doesn't seem to say anything at all - ITN and Sky can be anything but. Surley we are talking about the accurate reporting of facts, rather than the political standpoint the IMC makes?
elec40
e-mail: davedeans2001@yahoo.co.uk
Guardian
04.05.2001 12:16
Schmardian
What is independent?
04.05.2001 13:09
The claim of being 'independent' is one which has been grossly misused.
The discussion then about independent reportage then is loaded - I agree to some extent that propaganda from any side (be it pro or anti capitalism) clouds the issues and I feel that the 'truth' (whatever that may be) is often trully radical - no spin is needed when it is reported that nuclear waste trains are runnig along the train track at the bottom of your garden for example.
Ideally, the 'truth' could stand on its own being reported through non-hierarchical community news facilities but until that point there is always going to be some bias - we live in diisive times.
Dan
The Guardian sucks
04.05.2001 13:59
That said, I still flick through it because of all the mainstream newspapers the Guardian is the least bad.
Lemming
e-mail: lemming@grandtheftcyber.com
Ah well
04.05.2001 14:15
It is still the less-bad of all the newspapers.
elec40
e-mail: davedeans2001@yahoo.co.uk
guardian
04.05.2001 14:29
johnny
Don't Diss Monbiot
04.05.2001 14:33
Captive State: The Corporate Takeover of Britain.
He may not always agree with you / us / whatever
but he's not dissing anyone.
Mr S
George Monbiot
04.05.2001 15:48
He even praises Michael Meacher, who owns let me see...is it 8 houses? For fuck's sake! Even if Meacher isn't too bad for a New Labour politician (which I seriously doubt), he's part of the cabinet that unanimously decided to wage war with the people of Yugoslavia (to cite just one of their atrocities), which makes him a cold blooded murderer in my book.
I stand by my comments - Monbiot is a complete asshole, a hardline fluffy all the way. He writes absolute shit in the Guardian almost every week and has a history of condemning brave and dedicated activists who go beyond the legally sanctioned forms of protest and actually inflict some damage on the system that screws us over.
He's certainly not an anti-capitalist and *not* part of our movement. Remember when he said car workers should be laid off? Or when he continually argued for fuel tax? The guy's just a middle class green wanker who knows nothing about biocentrism and doesn't place his bleeding heart liberal reformist ideas in the wider context of class struggle.
Are you suggesting that we can destroy the capitalist system without using violent methods? Or that capitalism is OK just so long as we reform it a bit so that it's only moderately repressive and limits the rate at which it kills people and the planet?
Someone needs to get George Monbiot in the face with a custard pie at his next public appearance and tell him to piss off, same goes for John Vidal, Anita Roddick and all the middle class parasites that plague our movement.
Lemming
e-mail: lemming@grandtheftcyber.com
George (what-bandwagon-next) Monbiot
04.05.2001 16:04
This follows comments that digging up grass won't save the world, as in last years Mayday - yes of course when an action is quoted, simplified and taken out of context it can sound silly, but the ideas behind last years action were serious attempts to avoid confrontation and show examples of alternatives. Not a raging success but an attempt none the less.
Now he has throw his lot in with Globalise Resistance (swp+others) basically because the anarchists and environmentalists are sick of his defence of the State as the cure to all our evils.
He is a journalist that plainly found the movement useful when he needed credibility, but now his books are selling well and he has a regular column he is a bit embarassed by it all, hense the stream of comments.
Up to recently i respected his research (which turns out to be done by un-credited helpers) but now i begin to wonder how accurate that is if the small parts i know are so wrong.
Anyway i am going off the subject, basically this shows that journalism is a powerful tool and has to be watched carefully, it is too easy for it to slip, easy for the new friends to influence, too easy to use to settle old scores, too easy to abuse. And shows we have to educate ourselves and not rely too much on those articulate and confident ones that tend to change course when is suits.
julie
e-mail: julie@ziplip.com
wankiness
05.05.2001 10:07
You despise the proletariat. If not, prove what you doing to reach out to ordinary working class people.
Oh, and none of you are able to spell - despite the private school educations you all undoubtedly had.
ps - my middle class wanker thesis is proved by the fact you all have so much to say about The Guardian. If you were serious about revolution rather than simply being poseurs, you'd care a lot more about what was in The Mirror.
Wat Tyler
If we were working class we'd read the Mirror
05.05.2001 13:46
It's almost as bad as the Sun.
The Guardian is clearly the least bad newspaper
we've got.
Why should all working class people have to read
the Mirror? The tabloids are full of propaganda
and inconsequential shite. What's wrong with
reading the Guardian if it's at least a SLIGHTLY better
alternative.
You've got to rise above your prejudices. I know
it's hard, I was REALLY surprised the first time
I met a black person who liked classical music,
for example. You really shouldn't assume that
just because someone has a crap job (and let's
face it that's pretty much the definition of
being working class) they automatically have to read
rags like the Mirror.
Apparantly, according to John Pilger, The Mirror
used to be a decent left wing paper, kind of the
working class' s very own paper which stuck
up for their interests and stuff.. that was before
rupert murdoch launched The Sun and the management
of the mirror decided to copy it in order to survive..
before the new wave of 'journalists' came in,
the ones who refer to the readers as 'punters'.
Tabloids are utter wank. Their 'news' stories tend
to focus on let me see,
The Royal Family
Posh Spice
David Beckham
um.. that's about it really.
oh yeah "Bogus" Asylum Seekers.
And semi naked girls as well.
At least the Guardian tries to be quality orientated,
at least it has a vague policy of writing the truth,
rather than making stuff up.
So what if it's a middle class paper?
If the mirror is supposed to be a working class paper
then it's a pretty fucking patronising one.
And I'm sick of people calling the middle class wankers.
Does that make me a wanker then just because I was born 'middle class'? What do you expect me to do? Quit university, get a crap job and work on my cockney / scouse / brummy accent? How FAKE would that be!
I
Mr S
Capitalism
05.05.2001 16:44
of my live under communism. Let me tell you that this was hard life.
My home was in block of state flats which no-one in UK can imagine how bad this was.
I was work in state factory for wage which in UK was £5 a week. Food was very bad
and no real choice was to be made in shops which mainly were owned by state.
In this country you have more rights and freedoms than I had in ussr.
You must realise that your lives without capitalism would be much less.
.
Jorg
lives much less
06.05.2001 02:01
> lives without capitalism
> would be much less.
If I were to fail the coroprate media on anything, even more than their cheerleading for the police (insofar as the BBC seemed to become a PR video company for Scotland Yard etc), it would be their failure to address the fact that the demonstrators at Mayday prompt above all the raising of *alternatives*. Which means alternatives to the gulag *and* to UKplc. Whether a capitalist EuroSuperState would be better or worse than statist Russia is not really my most pressing concern - that would be finding a way of allowing the freedoms both denied. Why choose between these two? Because they're the noisiest? And, given that there's no reason to choose, why even compare them?
SuSIE Q
oh and another thing
06.05.2001 02:47
http://www.salon.com/comics/tomo/2001/04/30/tomo/index.html
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placing this below in case the html isn't live 'n' sparky:
click here, d00dz!
SuSIE Q
middle class wankers
06.05.2001 11:58
Joe
Right wing content in IMC
06.05.2001 15:42
Ref the Russian who wrote:
> You must realise that your
> lives without capitalism
> would be much less.
I think you mean "without the freedom you have here your lives would be much less". I can think of more than one capitalist state where life is pretty awful indeed, especially for certain groups. Life could be much better everywhere without oppressive state apparatus, but communist regimes do not retain a historic monopoly on oppression.
Jon
left or right is not an issue
07.05.2001 12:41
left and right are good for telling you which hand is which.
As a modern establishment term to calculate political standing or beliefs they mean nothing to me .
I stand on the left when i go down the escalaters to allow people to pass me on the right or is it left ?? perhaps i should stand in the middle .
Great britain is a christian country like most of the western world the society is based on a fantastic fairy tale, I won't go into details about who exactly wrote this tale and needless to mention the millions of innocent folk who were tortured and murdered in horrific circumstances for reasons
known only to big G
The catholic church is still alive and kicking and so are it's offsprings the Mafia and the P2 .
The same fairy story has been adapated for the folk who have been 'chosen' to be muslims and at some stage we can expect a christian / muslim war financed no doubt by rothschild and co. So to put it straight the moral values of UK society are based on the christian religion and also 2000 years of wars
and inhuman behaviour by the noble gentlemen and their ladies
who have used the population of the country as cannon fodder and factory slaves .. of course we are led to believe that those were the bad old days and things like that couldn't happen again but the level of misery is growing while a small elite amass vast fortunes the rest live in shit, bosnia was very close and it could happen anywhere ..
let's look forward to some more protest this year . bilderberger in sweden in June should be interesting .
G8 in Genova will be a tough one . The city authorites are planning to close the city centre one month before the event .
They are issuing all residents with passes to get into the centre with the veiw to keeping the demonstration out.
I already have a pass !!
luther blissett .. is everywhere ..and everyone
Luther blissett
e-mail: luther_blissett@wot4.net
RE Bilderburg comment
09.05.2001 10:56
PS One the most detailed analysis of the Bilderburg Group is actually by a Marxist Sociologist.
munkle
e-mail: munkle55@hotmail.com
BIASED CORPORATE MEDIA OR BIASED INDYMEDIA?
09.05.2001 13:23
BIAS BUSTER
e-mail: BOTH_AS_BAD_AS_EACH_OTHER@BIASED.COM
Homepage: www.anti_capatalists.r.generally.hypocrites.co.uk
Let's lose Monbiot and Klein!
09.05.2001 16:30
prescriptions are complete dead ends. Their solution to the world's problems is just more state control of multinational corporations. In other words, although they are loathe to admit it, they just want a return to the government intervention of the '50s and '60s.
This is completely impossible. Any attempts by one country to return to genuine full-employment, decent welfare etc. would make that economy uncompetitive. Even worse than that for the capitalists, it would encourage workers to demand more, as they did in mass rebellions of the '60s and '70s. This would then again begin to build a movement that could really threaten their whole system.
Consequently capitalism will never accept such a policy again. In fact the only role people like Monbiot and Klein have, is to build illusions that reforming capitalism is possible and that
the main problem with it is just 'unaccountable' corporations or 'globalisation'. The best they could ever do is to get into government to give an 'anti-capitalist' face to the same old vicious capitalist policies. This is not as unlikely as it seems. Most of the present Government are ex-lefties (some like Livingstone and Gus MacDonald are ex-Trotskyists - well to the left of Monbiot or Klein!).
Whatever we do in the future we must make it completely clear that the direct action movement is not just against 'unfair' trade or even the Bilderburg group but is against the whole system in which money controls our lives. The sooner we do this the sooner we can lose people like Monbiot and Klein and everyone who is trying to build cushy careers on the back of a movement that wants to abolish all 'careers', cushy and otherwise, and replace them with living!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Much better writing than that of Monbiot and Klein on Globalisation (and revolution) can be found at:
Sylvia
Homepage: http://www.freespeech.org/mayday2k/readings.htm
Independent?
12.06.2001 12:14
Indymedia is run for non-profit and the editorial content is a result of that. Interesting that most people see it as being left wing - might be more to do with the sort of news coverage they are used to reading !
Al
e-mail: dont.think@so
moderate alternative news
21.07.2001 13:22
The site is halfway between mainsteam and alternative in that it counterspins and moderates many common views and develops opinions unseen in other media.
But in the end again, it's up to you to think for yourself.
The Urban Monk
e-mail: -
Homepage: http://urbanmonk.blogspot.com