The point of your comment being what?

We will disagree with some of what underclassrising is about but i see nothing that is sectarian about this, just repose of the main news and some humor that hit the nail on the head..

it started of as news and then went into some crazy shit

So you call marching from a to be a good day out?

Like The SWP it is the same for The Anarchist you are deluded, the working class need not people like you on our side for you are the enigma of The Working Class..

So The Anarchist are now becoming organised (good to here if it was true) how is 40 to 60 a mass movement and just where was The Anarchist under 13 years of New Labour, where was the new vanguard of The Working Class?

In your fucking armchairs as per-norm and one dreads to think, the effort if took for some of you to get out of them armchairs, but of course there was a pub for you all to sit down and pontificate about the liberation of The Working Class

Of course everyone wants some thing for free, but if some one is offering you something for free, you would be wise to be suspicious.

The central government is quite happy to maintain a redundant labour force to curtail wage inflation, so the unemployed are providing a valuable service to the ruling oligarchy.

The rulers are happy to provide free schooling because they get to set the curriculum, an influence the mind set of the next generation of their tax slaves.

Pensions directly support the financial service industry. Housing benefit supports the privet rental sector, which supports the financial service industry.

What ever you think is being provided out of benevolence is designed to give a "kick back" to the ruling classes, you just have to look at it from out side of the left wing / right wing paradigm, pretty hard to do if you've been educated in the state system.

What are described as 'public sector jobs' can be seen as "government sector jobs" because the workers are accountable to the government, not the public. And the government is accountable to it's underwriters, the financial institutions, not the public.

The financial services controls the government, and it's the government that controls the public/government sector jobs, which in turn control us through policing, schooling, etc. Society truly functions as one single top down hierarchy. It is so designed to be in everyones interest to support the level above them. Of cause the public don't like being robed, quite so directly as the "bail outs" because it confronts them with the reality of their own financial captivity.

While we are all fighting for the interests of our respective positions, we are avoiding the real issue.

If we get something for free, we lose the ability to make it for ourselves, and that includes the ability to make our own social provisions. We are losing contact with our most basic means of production and so, getting locked in to the system of exploitation, presided over by the rulers of the global financial services industry.

Five to six thousand demonstrators joined the "Right to Work" protest against the Tories in Birmingham on 3 October, despite heavy rain.

The organisers (SWP) claimed 7000, the police said 3000. The last similar protest, organised by RTW/SWP under the slogan "Rage Against Labour" (later modified to "Rage Against New Labour") in Brighton on 27 September last year, drew about 4000.

There was a contingent from Birmingham Unison, a contingent of Midlands CWU members, and there were a lot of trade-union branch banners, not necessarily with big contingents behind them.

The main chants were "they say cutback, we say fightback" and "Cameron out". SWP placards said: "TUC: call a general strike".

Joe Morgan, the Birmingham and West Midlands regional secretary of the GMB union, is reported as being on the demonstration and saying: "This is just the start of the cuts and the fight against them.

"In Birmingham we've had 26,000 redundancy notices in the council. The council is riding on the back of the coalition government.

"We had a mass meeting last Thursday and said there's only one way to fight—and that is to strike. I think industrial action is inevitable. I was at the TUC when Brendan Barber said we need united action, I hope he means it this time."

Speaking at the start of the march, both Paul Mackney (speaking from the "Coalition of Resistance") and a speaker from "Right to Work" called for collaboration between COR and RTW. RTW is now backing the COR conference.

just wondering?

"I slipped through the police lines as they closed in and wandered around trying to stay with the kettle to varying degrees of success to bear witness should anything happen.. "

Don't slag others off when all you do, when out of your comfort zone, is 'wander around', 'bearing witness'......... 'bearing witness'? more like quaker than anarchist (and I have a lot of respect for quakers). It really pisses me off when all you lot do is act as armachair warriors, slagging off people who bother to turn out, and then when given the chance for a bit of autonomous action 'bear witness'..... I admire your principles, loath your hatred of people who prefer to protest peacefully, and hate the 2 facedness of what you do in reality.

The latest Tory buzzwords claiming the Party's war on the poor amounted to "people power" fell spectacularly flat on Sunday as thousands of trade unionists marched past their conference to show what the real deal looked like.

Ensuring an unpleasant Midlands welcome for delegates on the opening day of the conference, people from all walks of life braved soaking rain to declare their opposition to sweeping cuts in welfare and public sector spending.

Amid a heavy police presence, activists held a rally before the march with folk songs from local musicians Banner Theatre and speeches from leading figures in the trade union and anti-cuts networks.

Tory delegates and business leaders were due to discuss "people power" and "the big society" on the opening day of conference.

But the platitudes tied in poorly with the content of conference talks, which saw health and safety review chief Lord Young recommend a "rethink" of rules in local councils.

Proposed changes could see workers faced with more dangerous conditions on top of job cuts from a projected loss of 30 per cent of public sector funding.

But Right to Work chairman Paul Brandon set the tone for the afternoon declaring: "The resistance is starting now."

The rally and march, organised by the Right to Work campaign, was aiming to bring together different organisations, including the People's Charter campaign, to launch a series of actions to successfully oppose Con-Dem policies.

Labour MPs Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell, who have both campaigned constantly against the cuts agenda, brought solidarity from the Labour Representation Committee.

Mr McDonnell warned the Conservative Party that if the coalition government came for working people and their jobs and services "then we will come for you."

Keep the NHS public campaign group spokeswoman Dr Jackie Davis said the austerity and outsourcing measures spelled disaster for public sector workers, potentially making NHS employees "an endangered species."

GMB regional secretary Joe Morgan urged workers to recognise that "the only real power we have in this society is our industrial muscle."

"Contrary to the right-wing media lies, nobody wants to go on strike but, comrades, sometimes you have no choice," he said.

Activist network group Coalition of Resistance spokesman Paul Mackney congratulated the Right to Work campaign for organising the demonstration.

"I am here," said Mr Mackney, "to announce the beginning of the end of the Con-Dem government."

"We brought down the Heath government with trade union action in the workplace. This time, with an alliance of union action and community campaigns we will defend our public services and drive then from office."

CWU president Jane Loftus, whose union is affiliated to the Right to Work campaign, called for mass support for the campaign to keep the post public.

Prime Minister David Cameron, who has spent recent weeks doing the media circuit to try and justify savage attacks against people dependent on welfare provision, told his delegates that "good savings" could and would be made in welfare in order "to balance the budget."

But closing the rally, PCS general secretary Mark Serwotka countered the PM, declaring co-ordinated strike action to be "inevitable" if these cuts were not shelved.

"We should say loud and clear, 'not one public sector job should be lost or one penny of public spending cut to pay for this crisis," he added.

 johnm@peoples-press.com

So it seems there was a march.

And now the hard left are slagging off the anarchists (and vice versa) on Indymedia.

Some criticise those in power - currently the LibCons - for using a 'divide & conqueror' tactic. But it's not them that's dividing us. Oh no, we're doing that all by ourselves.

Love the way that people slag each other off for being 'armchair' - presumably all those that are accusing people of being armchair are not sitting in a comfortable room with an internet ready PC (as I confess I am).

Way to go people. David and Nick must be laughing themselves to sleep.

"Revolution, if your reading this why not next time make your flag poles out of slightly heavier wood, get blacked-up and get stuck in next time helping your anarchist comrades!"

Because an extra 30 kids would have done nothing against the police dogs, vans and thousands of police? Because black blocs are so effective in England?

Come back to reality mate. We take direct action as part of a mass movement with practical aims, not for fucking jollies. Small groups of anarchists who wanna ruck with the police are welcome to do it, but don't treat it like it was some grand act with real potential or accuse anyone of being cowards because they thought it was the wrong tactic. Also, I notice you aimed your criticism at us and not the other 6000 or so people on the demo- maybe try talking with the whole movement instead of writing them off?

"Love the way that people slag each other off for being 'armchair' - presumably all those that are accusing people of being armchair are not sitting in a comfortable room with an internet ready PC (as I confess I am)."

Steady on there chap. For all you know, some of these commentators may not be anarchists, they may well be right wing getting a laugh out of you.

Indymedia is a fantastic resource but its anonymous commenting setup makes it truly ideal for disruption and farming of division.

If you are an anarchist or a campaigner then you do not need to concern yourself with those who's comments are divisive and obstreperous (that means unruly).

Stick to what you know and if anybody says different, they weren't there, they don't care or they wouldn't dare!

Indymedia's comment sections are a feeding ground for those who love to see you fail.

Well done to everybody who turned out today. It was wet, cold and not very nice. The shit hasn't hit the fan yet but when it does (and it will) today will have be an important momentum builder for a much larger campaign.

Just don't make the mistake of walking away. Today is just the preface.

it would be good to see some

Even my relentless optimism was dimming, it has been for some years with myself and once more Sunday 3 10 2010 will go down as another spectacular of nothing but then i have come to expect nothing less nothing more and often i find shame is saying one is an anarchist and none more so than the current time..

Running off and avoiding the kettle only to become an ineffective force on the outside, may not always be the best thing to do. Perhaps its time to focus on resisting kettles from the inside too?

This kettle was small and heavily outnumbered by police, yet many resisted police attempts to film, ID and search. It's not a lot, but it's a start....

See reports at www.fitwatch.org.uk

anyone got any photos of the march, or the direct action bloc?

 http://www.demotix.com/hub/tory-conference
 http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=right+to+work+march+birmingham

I was in the kettle. Came to demo on my own and don't know the area around five ways so took me a few mins to find my bearings around the round-about after the kettle was released. As I was doing so saw all the pigs moving off to the vans on mass. A couple of mins after that saw two uniformed officers escorting a man dressed in faded black civi's and a faded black cap. I only got a glimpse as they passed, but I swear the guy in black looked just like FIT officer CW2073 Neil Williams; a familiar face for anyone who demonstrates in London regularly. After a minute or two I decided to see if I could get another look to confirm my suspicions. Couldn't find these guys again, but spotted another plain clothes cop with uniformed escort heading back up Broad Street. He was in the same faded black clothes, but without hat. Didn't recognise him. Interestingly both guys looked like they'd let their stubble grow for a day or two. Unfortunately, I didn't have a camera on me. Anyway, just thought I'd let people know there were plain clothes cops about. Looked to me like they'd infiltrated the demo. Anyone else see these guys?

Yeah I saw them both. Wearing the same trousers, and shoes pretty much. Not talking looking well nervous. Wearing the same berghaus detachable hoods one wearing a black bench top. All of their clothes looked freshly purchased.

They stuck right out...

bloccer... just to let you know your barking up the wrong tree with the two people you refer to.

A bit wet behind the ears maybe and new to the bloc yes, possibly a bit stupid for wearing a jacket with a name on it big yes. But undercover plod never in a million years.

I do realise these things get earlier every year, but let's get a grip: what people are referring here to here as a "Black Bloc" actually consisted of a pantomime with 30 or so over-excitable children in their very best anarcho drag, all masked up and pretty much waving placards proclaiming "please kettle me!"

Let's face facts here: if they *hadn't* been kettled the poor loves' feelings of disappointment would have been little short of crushing.

As it is, they turned up in their fancy dress, got hemmed in by the plod and everyone went home happy, with the "Bloc"ers' little fantasies of posing a threat to the state merrily intact.

Harmless enough, and entirely irrelevant to anything. let's just, for god's sake, not confuse it with anything actually resembling a strategic response to how we confront Osborne and the other cockends.

what would you propose we do?
(try not to say the usual shite, workplace/community organising, building viable alternatives, working class solidarity blah di blah di blah coz we know that already).
Concrete plan please widow twat face...

What a rude little boy.

I'm deeply sorry. I was unaware that I was precluded from expressing my derision at the foolish posturing of a handful of lairy students unless and until I was able to come up with a definitive and workable plan on how to destroy capitalism.

It's nearly dinner time now, mind. Could I get back to you with something around 4.30?

first of all, i'm not a boy, neither am i little.

a handful implies less than six, that was clearly not the case in relation to the black bloc on sunday.

also i was on the demo, in the black bloc, i am a worker, i am not a student. i know quite a few of the anarchists who were there, none of them are students either.

Nobody said you were"precluded from expressing your derision", however criticism without offering an alternative is a waste of everybodys time, some people might call it "sectarian", i call it counter-revolutionary. But besides sounding like a twat with a massive superiority complex, you also sounded as if you know some alternative and more usefull ways of expressing our anger at the torys/current political system/capitalism and organising against it.

4:30 is fine for you to get back to us. I'm sure we'll be astounded at your wisdom and kicking ourselves that we hadnt thought of it before.
xox

Well, half past 4 has come and gone and no sign of widow twanky letting us into the secret of organising for real and lasting social change.
Black bloc is a tactic, and by no means the only tactic anarchists should use, but it is a valid and useful way of raising our visibility and expressing our dissent.
Anarchists like widow twanky should stop coming onto indymedia sniping and bitching, putting people down in order to make themselves feel less impotent.
Save your unconstructive criticisms for places like libcom!

If Sunday showed me anything, it's how incredibly slack us British anarchists are. We did what we could, and yes it was very little. We got a bit wet, got kettled, and spent too much time posing for photo's. We did stupid things like stopping 15ft behind the people in front, leaving a large space for the police (who actually didn't take advantage at this point) to section us off from the other, all for the sake of a photo! And when we had the waste of time stand off by the barrier, word is that was for a photo as well, which was the point where the police got their backs up and started trying to section us off from the march.
We avoided their first attempt to kettle us just by running, but it didn't last long. A lack of impulsive group decision led to us running from the second kettle attempt too slowly, giving the police time to get numbers over and kettle us withing a bout 60ft of the march when we split off.
It sounds disheartening, and it was, but I think this should be a really massive kick up the arse for us. I mean, we were well on the way to a 200 strong black block and we caused the police some inconvenience at best. One chant from the day tells us exactly what we need to do:

"1, 2 ,3, 4 escalate the class war, 5, 6, 7, 8, ORGANISE AND SMASH THE STATE"

We need to get more organised, we need to think of new tactics, we need to push harder and hard, make the police know they can't opress us. But we can't do this without communication. On Sunday we weren't a black block, we were a group of anarchists dressed in black. We were small affinity groups rather than one group. We need to build on this, solidarity is strength, so we need to work on that the best we can.

In future, we could benefit a lot from finding a place for a large meeting in the city of action the night before. Then we can meet each other, scout out the area, make plans and organise. I believe this could make the difference between a group of anarchists dressed in black, and a true black block, taking direct action against capitalism and the state. But lets see what happens,, maybe Brighton will be better.

See you on the 13th for Hammertime,
Peace and solidarty x

I counted in the slightly bigger kettle they kept us in at the end (while I was waiting for the last few to come out of the smaller one) and there were about 50 of us. This could be slightly higher, or slightly lower.
The "black block" in the march was at least 120, but I would say more around 160/170.

I don't see why people are fighting so much over it. It did achieve nothing. But that's not a reason to slate it. If we fight this much amongst ourselves, we stand no chance in the greater struggle. There's little positive to say about Sunday, but that doesn't mean we should focus on the negative. Just leave Sunday behind, take only lessons from it and get organising together to actually achieve something.

Peace and Solidarity x