The increasing emergence of lap dancing clubs in the city was enough to make a group of local women and girls take up the challenge of fighting back against the exploitation of women's bodies for men's profit and enjoyment. The exploitation of women's bodies seems to be becoming a more and more acceptable medium for advertising and entertainment. What was once deemed politically incorrect 20 years ago is now deemed as being okay, It would seem that with all the Equal Opportunities policies we now have in society, women's equality is now considered guaranteed and safe from threat. Policies have actually resulted in women' issues being put on the back burner, the fight is over, so anyone discriminating against us in the workplace etc will be taken to court. However what we are actually left with is a green light to sexism, there is no resistance to exploitation of our bodies anymore, there doesn't need to be because there is a policy that does that for us!
Lap Dancing clubs are emerging everywhere, Birmingham has been described as the 'lap dancing capital of the country'. Adverts for Spearmint Rhino appear on billboards along the city’s major roads. Wherever you drive around the city, the image of a sexily clothed woman lying back under text that says, 'The Negotiator', is inviting men along to clubs to negotiate their price for her.
Women Fight Back are serious in their intention to rid the city of these centres of sexual exploitation and of the harm that they cause to women, children and society as a whole. Campaigning will take on many forms, there will be something for all women to get involved with, age is no problem, as long as you are female you can get involved. Email the link below for more info or get involved.
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Comments
Hide the following 22 comments
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09.07.2006 23:21
Are you suggesting that the are slave under the yoke of men in these clubs? Or are they using tehir sexuality to explot men?
Hypocracy in action.
.
Equality is not being bought or sold
09.07.2006 23:49
Medusa
.
10.07.2006 10:13
So what occupations are approved by you and the femmo-facists?
.
Exploitation of Men
10.07.2006 14:01
I can guarentee that all those mass group of women who go out on a Saturday night would laugh in the faces of these losers in Birmingham.
CLOWNS!
Blatently
The feminist freaks are back
10.07.2006 20:14
Secondly, as has already been said, women do not have one collective body. The women in these clubs are free to work there or not.
Thirdly, they do not see it as exploitation (of themselves), they see that they exploit their looks and figures to fleece men of their money just to see them naked.
Fourthly, do you campaign against gay strip clubs or male strippers? No, I didn't think so.
So, please fuck off back under whatever rock you crawled out from which has been locked in a time warp for 30 odd years when the lesbo-feminist freaks had some support.
Brutus
The women in these clubs are paid to take sexual harrassment
10.07.2006 20:20
I agree that these clubs exploit men as well - they distort men's sexuality suggesting to them that women are commodities to be bought and sold, that better sex can be bought for more money and that sex is something which requires payment, either through ongoing support, in kind or hard cash rather than a mutually pleasurable experience.
Medusa
really?
10.07.2006 20:26
I will happily declare myself to be a feminist and agree that strip clubs objectify and demean women.
But if feminism is going to have any future we have to stop saving people that don't want to be saved.
That way all we do is alienate men AND women, better to stop 'fighting' them and maybe get them on our side instead....?
a girl
Nothing wrong with being a Stripper
10.07.2006 22:07
I assume that the person who owns the email address "women fight back" and who did the graffiti is probably a man. Probably this man is intimidated by confident women as well.
It seems to me that he is the sexist and not anyone else here.
Elaine
Brutus needs a slap
11.07.2006 16:43
"The women in these clubs are free to work there or not." This is total bullshit.
Of course a woman can do what she likes with her body but do you really think that if a lap dancer had the choice to stand and dance in front of sleazy men for peanuts all day she'd do it? People argue and say women have a choice but you have to start realising WHY women choose to work in Lap dancing/ strip clubs, If women found just as easy to make as much money as men and globally were'nt potrayed as sex objects in the media then we would'nt even consider lap dancing. Women in modern society have ALWAYS found it hard to get employed and for years have been paid lower than men.
It also perpetuate an attitudes outside of Lap dancing clubs and pornography studios that makes objectification of women is something which affects all women in all walk of life.
Lap dancing/stripping is not a decent wage, there is NO decent wage for being objectifyed ..who gives a fuck if you dont get touched, its the fact that some man who owns that club is getting more money in his pocket a day then those women get in probably a month. The fact that they are unable to take maternity leave, forced to look a certain way, are not allowed to keep tips is exploitative.
There is strong evidence that dancers can suffer humiliation and sexual harassment on a regular basis, from customers and staff/management, many dancers begin working in lap-dance clubs through lack of real choice and its not just me that thinks this - it has actually been stated in the Glasgow city concil lap dancing report.
"they do not see it as exploitation (of themselves), they see that they exploit their looks and figures to fleece men of their money just to see them naked."
Excuse me! They?! Are you a woman? are you a lap dancer? .. umm no so i don't see why you are being so cocky,defensive and trying to talk on behalf of us.
Perhaps you could call it expolitiong their looks that are stereotypically 'sexy', this give you no right to say it makes it acceptable. The pure reason women are told certain features are sexy and that what makes you succesfull is exploitive in itself. Its exploitive in itself that Club owners employ women who fit in with that - which isnt to say that if they employed any women would make it better.
Well actually It not just for 'lesbos' like you said - It seems as though you Mr Bruster feels very threatened and the fact that you dismiss feminism with such gutter-press terms displays a shallow understanding of it.
We don't seek the support of Men like you Bruster because of course if we did wait for your support then there would be no progress for women in society at all.
Lap dancing was created by men, is controlled by men for men and i strongly believe that.
Rosie
When did I say any bad things about strippers?
11.07.2006 18:41
The difference between that and working in a strip club is that there is policy and legislation designed to protect these workers from harassment - but as a stripper accepting sexual abuse, taking your clothes to keep your job and pretending to be pleased about it, is a *part* of your job.
Medusa
Many women hate feminism as well!
11.07.2006 20:03
Another point is that some women go to lap-dancing clubs to see women.
I know that some female prostitutes will service female clients.
A substantial number of the people involved in women trafficked for prostitution are other women.
Women have been arrested and disciplined in jobs for sexually abusing and harassing both men and sometimes other women, not to mention children.
Radical feminists live in a world where millionaires like the deceased Andrea Dworkin and obnoxious self-publicists like Germaine Greer make their fame and fortune by convincing women that they are all equally oppressed by tyrannical, sex-obsessed men.
For an alternative view visit:
Brutus
As i have allready said medusa.
11.07.2006 20:13
We are not aiming just to close down the clubs we also want to make people more aware of exploitation of women generally in any workplace and/or enviroment.
Rosie
Men have the choice
12.07.2006 12:32
Well of course we are not going to be supporting men in strip clubs or gay clubs.. No because they have a choice, men generally find it far easier to find jobs and also have a much more higher wage than women in society.
Womens lap dancing clubs are far more normalised than Gay strip clubs, because lap dancing/stripping has become so socially acceptable it also means that the exploitation of women in everyday life has become more socially acceptable such as like medusa said in the office, restaraunt , in the media etc. So we feel strongly about tackling the Womens lap dancing clubs as it perpetuates an attitude of objectifying women in everyday life acceptable.Men seem to still be treated with the same respect regardless of the gay/strip clubs some of them choose to work in.
Men who work in Gay strip clubs/lap dancing clubs perhaps can be insulted and yes probably can be exploited but no way to the same degree as women do not just in the sex industry but in everyday life.
Rosie
Moronic feminist drivel.
12.07.2006 14:31
Additionally, I'm not quite sure how you conclude that men have the choice to become strippers but women are forced into it. I am currently unemployed but could not and would not want to be a stripper.
I know some women strippers and they do it because they earn so much more money and more easily than they would in a regular job.
The minimum wage in this country is £10,500 a year. The average wage is £24,000 a year. These apply equally to men and women. I have heard of women who have earned £1,000 in one night, purely for stripping naked - there isn't even sexual contact.
Most women who live in poverty do not become lap-dancers, but they are on benefits, or in low paid menial work, or turn to crime and get sent to prison.
Your freakish feminist arguments direct from Dworkin are about sexual repression, not about the rights and welfare of women.
Brutus
Freedom is for everyone
12.07.2006 18:43
Sure there can, if male sexuality can be sold as well (buying WOMEN or MEN themselves is not acceptable). Note not all club owners are male.
"The women are paid to take sexual harassment that would be unacceptable in any other workplace"
In that case empower the workers and have systems in place to stop harassment.
Although you later suggest that a stripper having to take her clothes off is sexual harassment in itself. If that is what you think, then I can't change your mind, but it does seem like circular reasoning.
"The Glasgow City lap dancing report"
This was commissioned by the (anti-lapdance) Glasgow Council and done by the (anti-lapdance) Julie Bindel. It is as impartial as studies by tobacco companies that show no harmful effects of passive smoking.
The solution to this problem is more equality. Hopefully in 20 years time, men and women will go to these clubs and watch men and women dance naked. Why not demand more male dancers and more gay/lesbian nights?
Why does equality in the sex/porn industry always have to be about reducing freedom for everyone?
Freedom is for everyone: repression sucks.
Carl Lewis
Re:
17.07.2006 13:08
Reply to Brutus's (what a matcho name - grrrr!) comments:-
Brutus: "you may not have noticed that more men are unemployed than women."
Woman get paid 18% less than men on average, so taking into account the fact that more men are unemployed than woman, this must be a conservative estimate.
And all this despite woman getting better grades than men at school and university.
Brutus: "Additionally, I'm not quite sure how you conclude that men have the choice to become strippers but women are forced into it. I am currently unemployed but could not and would not want to be a stripper."
If woman had the same opportunities in life as men for employment and earned the same, it is a fair assumption to make that far less woman would want to strip in front of pissed up men for a living.
Brutus: "I know some women strippers and they do it because they earn so much more money and more easily than they would in a regular job."
Stripping naked in front of jeering men is an easy job? You said yourself that you wouldn't do it! The vast majority of strippers are self employed so are not paid sick leave, a pension, or entitled to company benefits. They are not allowed to keep tips and are paid a flat rate. It is a myth that they are well paid.
Brutus: "The minimum wage in this country is £10,500 a year. The average wage is £24,000 a year. These apply equally to men and women."
This is plainly a lie. These figures do not apply 'equally to men and woman'.
Brutus: "I have heard of women who have earned £1,000 in one night, purely for stripping naked - there isn't even sexual contact."
So you have 'heard of' but do not know of anyone who has been paid that much? Have you ever thought that maybe strip club owners like to propagate the myth that strippers earn a lot of money because it eases the consiences of their customers? Have you thought that far less people would go to strip clubs if they knew that the owners were making a killing out of exploiting woman? I knew someone from school when I was younger whose mother worked in a strip club and I don't remember them being particularly well off, they lived in a very deprived area. She was a single mother and had a kid to support somehow. I imagine she did it either because it was the only work she could find, or, it paid marginly more than any other jobs and she loved her son and wanted to provide something slightly better for him. Not because her employment provided great job satisfaction, a friendly work environment, and great career progression opportunities!
Brutus: "Most women who live in poverty do not become lap-dancers, but they are on benefits, or in low paid menial work, or turn to crime and get sent to prison."
Yes, we have already concluded that woman earn at least 18% less than men so a more likely to live in poverty than men.
Brutus: "Your freakish feminist arguments direct from Dworkin are about sexual repression, not about the rights and welfare of women."
Brutus, sex is supposed to be a two way thing, you know, mutual. Strip clubs have very little to do with that. It seems that this is something you know very little about.
Brutus: "Freedom is for everyone"
(Except a woman's right to earn the same as a man for the same work)
Reply to Carl Lewis's comments:-
Carl, in our patriarchal society it is mostly men who are rich, not woman, so I think it is a fair assumption to make that it is mostly men who own strip clubs, especially since most woman find the idea aboherrent and could think of far more pleasant ways to make money. Just because you have watched a crap film where a woman owns a strip club it doesn't mean this is the norm. Yes, there is more gender equality today than there was 50 years ago, e.g. more woman in higher paying jobs and positions of power, but they have only managed to get their by exhibiting 'male' personality traits. A Margaret Thatcher or Condoleezza Rice can make the system appear liberal, but a woman who attempts to use power to serve nurturing values, as Hilary Clinton at times did, is virulently hated.
Carl said: "The solution to this problem is more equality. Hopefully in 20 years time, men and women will go to these clubs and watch men and women dance naked. Why not demand more male dancers and more gay/lesbian nights? Why does equality in the sex/porn industry always have to be about reducing freedom for everyone?"
It is also not desirable for men or woman to be sold as sexual commodities, what kind of warped vision of the future is that? Isn't demanding woman to be paid equally for the work they do so they are less inclinced to work in seedy strip clubs about increasing freedom, and less about repression? Should men making a killing out exploiting woman not be challenged?
Mike D
But
20.07.2006 18:39
We can't have equality everywhere tomorrow.
I believe having more equality in this industry is a move towards equality. We can agree to disagree on this.
I don't think that this is a warped vision. Strippers are not bought and sold. A lapdance is not a person.
Long live lap dance clubs!
Carl Lewis
e-mail:
dumjez041@btinternet.com
Also
20.07.2006 20:10
That is fair enough as far as it goes. However, I cannot believe that equal pay would mean the end of strip clubs, I think that some women and men would still be prepared to work in them.
Also, what if, having been provided with extra pay, these women decided to spend some of it on watching male or female strippers? Shouldn't they be allowed to or are we only be allowed the freedoms you think are acceptable?
Carl Lewis
Why the strip club debate needs to look beyond the women directly involved
26.08.2006 14:38
Radical feminists live in a world where millionaires like the deceased Andrea Dworkin and obnoxious self-publicists like Germaine Greer make their fame and fortune by convincing women that they are all equally oppressed by tyrannical, sex-obsessed men."
The tone of your posts is very defensive, Brutus. No one here is saying that women are perfect, men are evil. Of course not. And yes, women too attend strip clubs sometimes, and in reference to your point above, yes some women commit sexual offences. However to put that in context, the male:female ratio for sexual offences in 1990 was 105:1 (Tarling 1993). So I'm not sure your point is a particularly strong one, whatever it is.
Furthermore, research in 1985 Hall found that 1 in 6 women had experienced rape and 1 in 3 sexual assault. Criminologists are increasingly finding that women's fear of crime can often be better described as fear of sexual danger (Walklate 2004). Perhaps you cannot imagine this because you're not a woman, that doesn't mean you should assume that it's all a myth. I would argue that this constant sexualization of the female body, not helped by strip clubs and the like, which objectifies the body as separate to the person, merely increases the sense that women are available as commodities for men.
On a different level, consider the sheer quantity of advertising and industries based upon trying to persuade women to change themselves. The expectation upon professional women to wear make up, on women generally to remove their body hair, and increasingly to undergo surgical procedures to fit better into the beauty industry's idea of what a woman 'should' look like. Men do not, to any near such an extent, experience this pressure to be attractive and sexy for all and sundry, regardless of whether they are at work or not. Women's appearance is constantly rated as more important, or as important, as their intelligence, even from the very beginning - for an example of this, this of newborn babies: a baby girl will be described as beautiful, a baby boy as 'bouncing' or healthy.
This culture i'm describing is real, pervasive and inescapable for women at all points in their life, and in all environments. Perhaps some women are more conscious of it than others, but all experience it as a form of oppression. Some try to use it to their advantage e.g. by working in strip clubs. I do not say we should necessarily shut them down, but I do say that, like porn magazines and films, they contribute to, and perpetuate atttitudes to women that have a direct and harmful affect on all women. When discussing strip clubs therefore, this greater phenomenon has to be considered, and not merely the question of the particular girls and clients' in the clubs own motivations and experiences.
birminghamgirl
reply
28.08.2006 02:12
You obviously don't know (or care) about the gay community where the pressures to be buff, wealthy, accomplished, good looking, well hung, etc, are regarded as being at least as important as for heterosexual women.
But sorry, you were saying how hard done by women are, but then feminists always say that! It helps you sell more books.
If looks and physique are so important to men, why is it that genetically unattractive women haven't disappeared from the gene pool?
Or is that beyond your level of intelligence?
Brutus
Repsonse to Brutus
28.08.2006 16:59
Why? It certainly doesn't strengthen your argument.
The reason I was talking about how "hard done by" (as you put it) women are, in terms of their objectification as sex objects by our society, rather than about the gay community, is because the debate we're having here is about strip clubs in Birmingham, most of which, it is fair to say, employ women, and because that is what I believe this movement we are commenting on ('Birmingham Women Fight Back') is about.
Incidentally what makes you think all feminists are trying to sell books?? I know I'm not.
Is it impossible you for to imagine that someone could take a principled stand on an issue without having a concealed, ulterior motive, or personally vested interest? Haven't you ever believed in something strongly enough to take action that you didn't stand directly to benefit from?
Birminghamgirl
Also
28.08.2006 17:07
You have misunderstood me.
I was not saying that "looks and physique are so important to men". I was saying that strip clubs may encourage an attitude to women in general that doesn't look beyond appearance, and treats women as sexual objects, an attitude which is also encouraged by other features of our society such as the advertising industry.
I was certainly not saying that all men treated or regarded women in that way.
Birminghamgirl